2011 HMRS

[jimmydeanno]

RE: Have to give the cadets something...

Coins are cool, and cadets like them.  So add $4.75 to the price of admission and buy coins.

There was a time when receiving a coin from a General Officer meant something other than just "being there"...

They still do, but Generals give out coins that say, "Presented by the Commander" or something like that.  People know the difference between participation coins and commanders' coins.

[NCRblues]

RE: Have to give the cadets something...

I thought that was the whole point of the NCSA Ribbon, SAR Ribbon, and FIND Ribbons that they earn while they're there...

Much like the giving a Cadet Competition Team a commander's commendation for winning the Wing competition...isn't that what the ribbon is for?

Coins are cool, and cadets like them.  So add $4.75 to the price of admission and buy coins.

The only ribbon they are guaranteed to get is the NCSA. The SAR and FIND are not guaranteed at all. I know many flights who did not get the SAR ribbon, and barley got the FIND. It all depends on if what is going on while your flight is on an ES shift.

[JC004]

RE: Have to give the cadets something...

Coins are cool, and cadets like them.  So add $4.75 to the price of admission and buy coins.

There was a time when receiving a coin from a General Officer meant something other than just "being there"...

They still do, but Generals give out coins that say, "Presented by the Commander" or something like that.  People know the difference between participation coins and commanders' coins.

I have "I was there" coins (like Civic Leadership Academy for one) and General Officer coins with the neat little flags w/ stars on them (Army in this case).  One from the wing CC too...

[Hawk_Girl]

Well, the results are out, and I'm going to Hawk this year!  Anybody else going this year? Cadet or Officer Basic, or an advanced course? Which one?

     -GTCommando

Congrats! I hope you have fun!! I was signed up for Romeo, then screwed up my knee so you and my other Ranger family members will have to enjoy it for me!

[Nathan]

A blue beret costs around $8-10 at my local surplus store, last time I checked.

[titanII]

A blue beret costs around $8-10 at my local surplus store, last time I checked.

That would be a good solution if everyone at NBB bought themselves a US mil spec beret (if there is such a thing). Only problem I could think is that not everyone as a surplus store near them. But then again, they might be able to find one online or on Evil-Bay.

[sarmed1]

Back......interesting week.  Let the unpacking, washing, and bathing begin.

Short report:
Great weather; minimal rain
lots of students....190ish between basic's and advanced squadrons
1 real world mission tasking during the school
No serious injuries; 2 went to the hospital, but not bad enough to need an ambulance.
There were no issues that I found with the new medication administration policy

mk

[airdale12]

Back......interesting week.  Let the unpacking, washing, and bathing begin.

Short report:
Great weather; minimal rain
lots of students....190ish between basic's and advanced squadrons
1 real world mission tasking during the school
No serious injuries; 2 went to the hospital, but not bad enough to need an ambulance.
There were no issues that I found with the new medication administration policy

mk

what squadron were you assigned to?

[airdale12]

I look forward to seeing you both there. Just look for the Chief from OHWG with GTM2 and mirror-shined boots and there I am!  Just a side note, are the white boot laces I've seen required for graduation? 

What is ur name and what squadron where you assigned to?

[GTCommando]

I look forward to seeing you both there. Just look for the Chief from OHWG with GTM2 and mirror-shined boots and there I am!  Just a side note, are the white boot laces I've seen required for graduation? 

What is ur name and what squadron where you assigned to?

C/CMSgt Caleb King, Alpha Squadron. Hawk was a blast! I went with an open mind, actually learned some things, cleared a lot of misconceptions and got more leadership experience than I could have imagined at a SAR school. More to follow, but I'm getting tired of this computer, so I'll try to post some more info in the next few days.

[sarmed1]

....Mike Squadron......as an instructor, I also taught for the Air Crew Survival course.

mk

[rebowman]

WHY do attendees not graduate with GTM3?   

Whats the point of Hawk if no GT qualification?   Being a Ranger means nothing unless you are PAWG.

[sarmed1]

WHY do attendees not graduate with GTM3?   

Whats the point of Hawk if no GT qualification?   Being a Ranger means nothing unless you are PAWG.

as the ops guy explained it to me once.....for most cadets HMRS is a leadership lab disquised as an ES school.  The point being to learn the lessons of leadership, followership and teamwork (both for cadet staff and students).  Conveniently most of these attributes come in very handy in the world of ES, so using the medium of ES work has a twofold function.. you get some usefull ES skills that honestly for most grads once they pass a few more years in CAP maybecome usefull, plus that whole leadeship lab thing.

Seniors and older cadets seem to always come out of the school with the qualifications they go in looking for.  I posted in the Hawk vs NESA thread a spreadsheet detailing the GTM tasks vs Ranger grade, check it out (as I pointed out there) the only 3 skills not hit on at the school for the typical basic are heading and locate distress beacon and BCUT, everything else in the basic year should be up to GTM2 (minus misions, I think there is only 1 or 2 sorties during the school, but dont quote that one for sure) so you may not come out of the school GTM qual'd, but you could be easily once you return home.

mk

And honestly, being a Ranger has little ES use even in PA......

[Eclipse]

And honestly, being a Ranger has little ES use even in PA...

Then why is there so much sizzle and so little steak?

SARMED, everything you have said in all the threads makes logical sense, but the external experience of many of us here doesn't seem to match
your assertions.

If nothing else HMRS needs a new publicist.

[sarmed1]

For those that did actually go to the school, is there anything in particular that you did not like, or didnt work out well that you think the school could do better.  Or that you thought worked out well.

I ask, because I am looking for input to take to the AAR .....

(and PS I am already talking to stan/eval about the mis-match to GTM quals)

mk

[sarmed1]

As far as the use of Rangers...well its still not on the 101 card so mission wise your still kinda limited to the GTM level. Now given PA IC's know that if a team shows up of mostly GTM3's on the 101, but they are mostlyl R/1's there is a little flex in what you can expect out of them as far as mission capability; outside of PA, well if you dont understand what you have, how can you expect to employ it at its best.

My personal opinion is that the qualification system needs overhaul.  In a day with no standards for GT's it was well ahead of its time.  Today, with the extensive GTM training and qualification systems, not so much.... there is still a value to some of the training and to some of the tactics of the ranger team concept, but its disroportional to the hoopla.  Just like many things in CAP though change is warranted, change is still usually slow.  I'd say simply I am one voice in a hundred; and primarily an advisor, not a policy maker at that, but I offer the suggestions when asked.    The only other option is command directed change, and usually radical change like that in a volunteer organization does more damage than repair, and I dont see the critical safety or finacial problems that usually drive such an action.

mk

mk

[airdale12]

I look forward to seeing you both there. Just look for the Chief from OHWG with GTM2 and mirror-shined boots and there I am!  Just a side note, are the white boot laces I've seen required for graduation? 

What is ur name and what squadron where you assigned to?

C/CMSgt Caleb King, Alpha Squadron. Hawk was a blast! I went with an open mind, actually learned some things, cleared a lot of misconceptions and got more leadership experience than I could have imagined at a SAR school. More to follow, but I'm getting tired of this computer, so I'll try to post some more info in the next few days.

Outstanding Im glad you got your moneys worth! You had an outstanding staff! Krakower is an great leader too. I was on of you TC in training.

See you next year! 

[airdale12]

GTCommando
Your attitude is refreshing. I can agree with most of what you say. HMRS was originally designed as a PAWG activity. As such it's excellent. I disagree with you in I have seen several cadets and seniors that have a Hawk attitude and wear all the bling. One ranger patch is enough for any person that has attended. Possibly different colors on the patch for the levels of training. But get rid of the rest of the bling.
Further, the HWRS training should be expanded to a Region level activity in each Region. The reason being almost every Region is different grographicaly with different training needs. Hawk should be the model for the regional training. How many Pacific Region cadets can afford the travel and expenses of attending Hawk? CAP cadets in Florida for example do not need to know how to carry a victim down a mountain since there are no mountains, and EMS would be on scene in such a short time or rescue helicopters to transport victims from the middle of the Everglades.

Sir,
I'm sorry but I don't think you are ever going to see that. Ranger parade uniform has been present at the school for years and mean a lot to those who have been at the school since the early days. I don't see why many make a big deal about it. Ranger parade is only to be used at Hawk, it is not something you wear to your squadron meeting or an encampment. In regards to the training, yes you are right, the chances of me performing a pick up or a low angle rescue are very low, unless its a garbage disposal worker who got stuck halfway on a land fill side and they would use someone else for the job. But in middle school I learned about the 9 planets, and I don't know when in my life that was useful but to pass the test. Where I'm getting here is that the fact that we can do it, is great, you never know maybe one day I really use it, and knowing something else isn't going to hurt me at all.

Hawk to me was about 1,100 dollars. My parents really couldn't help me pay for it at all, and I don't work. How did I make it? I wrote sponsorship letters to businesses and they helped me. I also sold chocolates at school to pay for Hawk. If you really want to do something, YOU CAN!