I'm doing some research on statutory language in state code and research on relationships between CAP and states.
JFK, see what you started?
>:(
Quote from: Luis R. Ramos on June 12, 2017, 07:04:17 PM
JFK, see what you started?
>:(
What's wrong with examining the relationships other wings have with their states? Positive relationships are something you can never have enough of, and while every state is going to be different, there's no reason not to identify who's doing things right.
Quote from: Luis R. Ramos on June 12, 2017, 07:04:17 PM
JFK, see what you started?
>:(
I'm actually working to find ways to better CAP/State relationship dynamics. And there is literally zero way this can be considered an OPSEC concern since I'm just asking about laws on the books and if the state and the CAP wing in that state play nice.
It's not OPSEC, but it also might be "not for air" - in a lot wings the relationships are strained at best,
many times for reasons outside CAP's control, but calling that out won't make it "better".
Your best bet is to probably look to wings which have publicly acknowledged successful relationships
and focus there.
NYWG, PAWG, and AKWG, at least based on their state appropriations, would seem to be a good start.
And in nearly all cases, the public laws or appropriations will be available from a respective Governor's office's website.
Quote from: Eclipse on June 12, 2017, 07:50:41 PM
It's not OPSEC, but it also might be "not for air" - in a lot wings the relationships are strained at best,
many times for reasons outside CAP's control, but calling that out won't make it "better".
Your best bet is to probably look to wings which have publicly acknowledged successful relationships
and focus there.
NYWG, PAWG, and AKWG, at least based on their state appropriations, would seem to be a good start.
And in nearly all cases, the public laws or appropriations will be available from a respective Governor's office's website.
Well this is why I asked for the "best" relationships. I have a good idea on which wings have worse relationships. But we can't make it better if we don't examine the problem.
Quote from: Eclipse on June 12, 2017, 07:50:41 PM
NYWG, PAWG, and AKWG, at least based on their state appropriations, would seem to be a good start.
I'd add NCWG to that list.
Off hand, I know that Maryland and New Jersey both have strong relationships with their respective military departments/emergency management agencies. Others have had relationships in the past, in the mystical days of the MOU. Each state has their laws online. Barring anyone having a list of what states have written CAP into their laws, just search them. Shouldn't take more than an episode of "Fear the Walking Dead" and would be time much better spent...
Quote from: THRAWN on June 12, 2017, 08:54:33 PM
Off hand, I know that Maryland and New Jersey both have strong relationships with their respective military departments/emergency management agencies.
NJ- Military? Yes. EM/State Police, eh. Appropriations? Zero. Not recently, anyway.
Isn't Wing HQ still at McGuire? If so, that constitutes a pretty good relationship. I believe the encampment is still held there, too.
Quote from: SarDragon on June 12, 2017, 09:43:00 PM
Isn't Wing HQ still at McGuire? If so, that constitutes a pretty good relationship. I believe the encampment is still held there, too.
But that's the problem - that's Federal, which means the state probably doesn't even know they exisit.
The other related issue is that
certain state agencies may know about CAP, and even have MOUs, while
other agencies have no relationship, nor even know what CAP is. BTDT.
And for that matter, having a Wing HQ at a state-owned facility or building may not constitute any
relationship beyond the lease itself.
I'd guess that most partnerships aren't spelled out in any statute, so searching there would be fruitless.
Quote from: EMT-83 on June 12, 2017, 09:56:13 PM
I'd guess that most partnerships aren't spelled out in any statute, so searching there would be fruitless.
Idaho
"TITLE 39
HEALTH AND SAFETY
CHAPTER 71
HAZARDOUS SUBSTANCE EMERGENCY RESPONSE ACT
39-7114A. CIVIL AIR PATROL. (1) There is hereby established within the military division and the Idaho office of emergency management the Idaho directorate of civil air patrol. The mission of the directorate shall be to provide support for and facilitate the operation of the civil air patrol, Idaho wing, which shall be under the command and control of the duly appointed commanding officer of such wing.
(2) In consideration for services rendered to the state of Idaho by the directorate of civil air patrol, Idaho wing, the military division shall provide in-kind services to the directorate in the form of land use, hangar facilities, mess and billeting facilities, office space and other entities when deemed necessary and when such facilities are available.
History:
[39-7114A, added 2012, ch. 313, sec. 1, p. 862; am. 2016, ch. 118, sec. 5, p. 334.]"
That's one, and you'll probably find a few more. But will they have any bearing on the "which states have the best partnership with CAP" question? What happens to the partnership when Idaho decides that facilities are no longer available?
Connecticut Wing headquarters is at state facility; three squadrons are housed in other state facilities, encampment is held at yet another state facility. The CAP repeater system is co-located on state police radio towers and linked via the state microwave system. CAP has a seat at the table at the state EOC. Tens of thousands of dollars in state funding supports CAP flight operations every year.
There's not a single state statute that mentions CAP, but I would say that a pretty decent partnership exists.
Quote from: EMT-83 on June 13, 2017, 12:33:01 AM
That's one, and you'll probably find a few more. But will they have any bearing on the "which states have the best partnership with CAP" question? What happens to the partnership when Idaho decides that facilities are no longer available?
Connecticut Wing headquarters is at state facility; three squadrons are housed in other state facilities, encampment is held at yet another state facility. The CAP repeater system is co-located on state police radio towers and linked via the state microwave system. CAP has a seat at the table at the state EOC. Tens of thousands of dollars in state funding supports CAP flight operations every year.
There's not a single state statute that mentions CAP, but I would say that a pretty decent partnership exists.
https://www.cga.ct.gov/current/pub/chap_266.htm#sec_15-98
Sec. 15-98. Connecticut Wing Civil Air Patrol. Clerical assistance. (a) The Connecticut Wing Civil Air Patrol shall be within the Department of Emergency Services and Public Protection and may expend funds, within available appropriations, for the acquisition, installation, conditioning, rental and maintenance of equipment and facilities and for expenses incurred in connection with senior and cadet training; provided no funds shall be expended for the purpose of uniforms or personal effects, or for salaries of members of said civil air patrol, except as set forth in subsection (b) of this section.
(b) The wing commander of the Connecticut Wing Civil Air Patrol may employ clerical assistance at headquarters for such duties as may be required by the wing commander. The commander of the Connecticut Wing Civil Air Patrol may issue vouchers for all expenditures covered by this section, and the Comptroller shall convert such vouchers into warrants, and the Treasurer shall pay the same out of the General Fund.
Quote from: Nor'easter on June 12, 2017, 09:31:11 PM
Quote from: THRAWN on June 12, 2017, 08:54:33 PM
Off hand, I know that Maryland and New Jersey both have strong relationships with their respective military departments/emergency management agencies.
NJ- Military? Yes. EM/State Police, eh. Appropriations? Zero. Not recently, anyway.
Still have squadrons at Guard armories? Still get the CP grants from DMAVA? Still have a seat at the table at the EOC? Still involved in the aviation day at EWR through the NJDOT? Is the wing still a member of the NJ EMA? There are many ways to have relationships other than appropriations.
Quote from: Spaceman3750 on June 12, 2017, 08:23:03 PM
I'd add NCWG to that list.
Came here to say this.
Granted, I don't have much to compare it to, since my time in CAWG was spent very minimally in ES, but NCWG seems to have an awesome relationship with the state emergency management agency. IIRC, we have a solid CAP presence in the state EOC during disasters and I believe we've even got some members working directly for NCEM (paid, full-time employment) acting as liaison to CAP.
Quote from: Mordecai on June 12, 2017, 05:23:26 PM
I'm doing some research on statutory language in state code and research on relationships between CAP and states.
I did that same thing about 15 years ago and I really don't think that you'll find much of interest in the statutory language that would provide insight on the true relationships with the state. That being said, you might assume that states with CAP-leave laws may get along better, but that is actually more likely to represent a better relationship between the Wing and members of that state's legislature rather than anything that hints at operational relationships.
Considering the mess that the national response framework is, even a healthy relationship
between AAWG and the respective "state", per se, might not mean anything.
CAP could be the AE provider of record for a state, yet due to local sheriffs having control of
Emergency Management, never get a single mission.
Having an MOU with the state's Guard means nothing if the Guard is never called out for anything.
And if local-local LEAs and FDs view CAP as "competition" for their people's overtime, etc., the Guv'na
and the Wing CC could be golf buddies and it won't mean anything. This is especially an issue with
CD activity, but shows up in just about everything. There are a lot of unions who don't look kindly on
volunteers eating a full timer's lunch.
To me this issue is something which falls squarely on NHQ to manage / cajole / lobby at the National
level with Congress and the 3-& 4-Letter agencies, perhaps walking the halls with someone from 1AF
in tow, trying to convince the people who sign the check every year that they aren't getting their money's
worth because of what are essentially "state's rights" issues.
The problem with >that< is that a lot of states ask FEMA for money, but not resources. They just want
Uncle Sam to pay for the overtime, pallets of water, and avgas for their own people, so even if we're on
FEMA's speed dial, no one pushes the button.
There needs to be some pressure from above that "CAP's on your first call sheet, every time...", which of course then
leave CAP to answer the phone, which doesn't happen with much consistency in most wings.