Shirt Cut Differences?

[a2capt]

Occasionally I see this type of shirt, both in use and on the shelf at military clothing sales. It's specifically labeled as mens, and the buttons are on the proper side, but the lapels are more like the female blouse style.


Basically, the collar wants to lay flat more than stand up.


While the common one we use is labeled "TYPE II", and this other one, I want to say is labeled CLASS I. The shade is the same, and the weave. I figured it was old style, except someone came back recently from clothing sales and had one. Ended up returning it because it was different, but the fit was much better in the same size.

[Newslick]

I believe that the shirts with a collar that lies more flat are intended to be worn without a tie. They may not have a button or hole at the very top as well, as they are never meant to be buttoned all the way up. At least Navy ones did not have a button or hole.

Of course all long sleeve AF dress shirts are worn WITH a tie, and they all have a stand collar. The short sleeve shirts with a stand collar look extremely weird without a tie.

Anyone know if this is correct?

[jimmydeanno]

Of course all long sleeve AF dress shirts are worn WITH a tie, and they all have a stand collar. The short sleeve shirts with a stand collar look extremely weird without a tie.

As someone who thinks they have pretty good taste in men's fashion, I'd argue that any shirt that has its collar pressed flat is extremely weird.  The second thing I'd note is that only dorks wear a tie with a short-sleeved shirt.  The third thing I'd note is that anyone with real fashion sense wouldn't wear a short-sleeved dress shirt anyway, especially with pockets (or a long sleeve with pockets).

But, I suppose it's ok for a military uniform.

[Luis R. Ramos]

Who decided that long-sleeved men's shirts with pockets are not fashion-conscious? Who made you jury and judge? You may not like it, that's fine, but you cannot say it is not fashionable.

With that statement, you are declaring yourself young. I am 58, and for years I have been seeing men's fashion designers make men's long sleeve shirts with pockets.

Stating pocket-less long-sleeved men's shirts are fashionable is like stating that wearing men's pants at the knee is fashionable. A matter of opinion.

Flyer

[jimmydeanno]

Who decided that long-sleeved men's shirts with pockets are not fashion-conscious? Who made you jury and judge? You may not like it, that's fine, but you cannot say it is not fashionable.

With that statement, you are declaring yourself young. I am 58, and for years I have been seeing men's fashion designers make men's long sleeve shirts with pockets.

Stating pocket-less long-sleeved men's shirts are fashionable is like stating that wearing men's pants at the knee is fashionable. A matter of opinion.

Flyer

Typically things that are "en vogue" are not determined by the older generation of anyone.  Shirts with pockets are out of style, it's not just me that decided.  The designers still putting pockets on shirts are appealing to an older crowd, or people still looking for a place to put their pack of cigarettes or pocket protector.

Here's an interesting stat:  "Whether or not you should opt for a chest pocket is going to depend a lot on what kind of job you have and what is considered acceptable attire in your workplace. In the high-end corporate world where a suit and a tie are required, there are a lot of modern formal-dress fashionistas who look down on the pocket as unprofessional – which may have something to do with the 65% drop in pocket-equipped dress shirt sales over the past ten years."

I cringe every time I put on my CAP polo shirt because it was designed by someone who thought that 4-button polos with pockets were awesome.  If I search any clothing store, I can't find 1) a 4-button polo, or 2) one with a pocket.  I was just at Men's warehouse the other day, and lo and behold, all their featured shirts were all pocket-less.  At lower end stores, like Walmart, I have to actually check the package to make sure that the outdated smoker's pocket has been removed.

For years I've also seen fashion designers make crocs, but you don't see me calling them fashionable.

I'm sorry to tell you this, but your member's only jacket has also fallen out of fashion.

[jimmydeanno]

I am 58, and for years I have been seeing men's fashion designers make men's long sleeve shirts with pockets.

Oh, and just as an aside to this comment...button shirts with pockets didn't come into style until around 1960.  Prior to that, no pockets.  It's just like nobody wearing double-breasted suits anymore, or suits with 5-buttons.  Shoulder pads are out, pleated & cuffed pants as well.

This is what us "young guys" are wearing these days:



Note that there aren't any pockets, flat front trousers, slimmer cuts, structured jackets, etc. 

If you go to top designer websites, you'll find that the shirts with pockets are being labeled as "classic" and "retro." 

[NIN]

If you go to top designer websites, you'll find that the shirts with pockets are being labeled as "classic" and "retro."

But.. but.. where do I put my PENS?

[Devil Doc]

I am 58, and for years I have been seeing men's fashion designers make men's long sleeve shirts with pockets.

Oh, and just as an aside to this comment...button shirts with pockets didn't come into style until around 1960.  Prior to that, no pockets.  It's just like nobody wearing double-breasted suits anymore, or suits with 5-buttons.  Shoulder pads are out, pleated & cuffed pants as well.

This is what us "young guys" are wearing these days:



Note that there aren't any pockets, flat front trousers, slimmer cuts, structured jackets, etc. 



If you go to top designer websites, you'll find that the shirts with pockets are being labeled as "classic" and "retro."

I am 27 and I dont wear this style. I like the buttons and pockets, make you pop more. I shop at goodwill, so wearing designer clothing is only if i can get it cheap. I wear Khakis and Polos at work, all day everyday. When I wear a suit, it is double breasted has pockets, cuff links, etc. IMO, the new style makes you look to much "METRO" but i digress. Id rather wear a T-Shirt and Pants to every function if i could.

[NIN]

Where the hell is Kieloch when we need him?

[Cliff_Chambliss]

I am 58, and for years I have been seeing men's fashion designers make men's long sleeve shirts with pockets.

Oh, and just as an aside to this comment...button shirts with pockets didn't come into style until around 1960.  Prior to that, no pockets.  It's just like nobody wearing double-breasted suits anymore, or suits with 5-buttons.  Shoulder pads are out, pleated & cuffed pants as well.

This is what us "young guys" are wearing these days:



Note that there aren't any pockets, flat front trousers, slimmer cuts, structured jackets, etc. 

If you go to top designer websites, you'll find that the shirts with pockets are being labeled as "classic" and "retro."

Same Pair of pants every day???

[The Infamous Meerkat]

a2capt - The shirt there, with the arrow pocket flaps and pressed collar was phased out for the new one with the squared flap with cut corners and the pleated pocket. As far as I know, the shirt pictured is no longer authorized for wear. I've seen them at Boise Army/Navy with six stripe Master Sergeant stripes on them.

JimmyDeano - am I to understand that you seriously wear formal wear every day of the week? I sort of get the 'Marlboro pocket' concept you're talking about, but get real.... Any normal guy thinks that a dress shirt and jeans are an attempt at looking flashy, and any twenty-something guy will tell you that the guy in his college class wearing the JCrew Ludlow jacket is a goober, plain and simple.

[jimmydeanno]

JimmyDeano - am I to understand that you seriously wear formal wear every day of the week? I sort of get the 'Marlboro pocket' concept you're talking about, but get real.... Any normal guy thinks that a dress shirt and jeans are an attempt at looking flashy, and any twenty-something guy will tell you that the guy in his college class wearing the JCrew Ludlow jacket is a goober, plain and simple.

We were talking about equivalents to the service dress shirt.  The current trend in fashion is no pockets, well-fitting, not single or double pocket and shaped like a box. 

I don't wear (as you put it) "formal wear" (although I don't see anything above that would be considered "formal") everyday, but even so, whatever pants I'm wearing WILL NOT have pleats or cuffs, the shirt WILL NOT have pockets.  Even if I'm wearing the shirt with jeans and sneakers, it still meets the criteria above.

[The Infamous Meerkat]

Consider your signature line in context with all of your "Fashion rules" my friend.

You've got the same guy in three suit jackets, jackets which were designed BITD to make even the largest or unflatteringly formed man look good as formal wear. We may have changed them to be more form fitting nowadays, but they have always been more formal than your average clothing. If you don't think a suit jacket and slacks are formal wear (no matter how loosely or uncaringly you wear them) you are simply wrong.

[lordmonar]

Occasionally I see this type of shirt, both in use and on the shelf at military clothing sales. It's specifically labeled as mens, and the buttons are on the proper side, but the lapels are more like the female blouse style.


Basically, the collar wants to lay flat more than stand up.


While the common one we use is labeled "TYPE II", and this other one, I want to say is labeled CLASS I. The shade is the same, and the weave. I figured it was old style, except someone came back recently from clothing sales and had one. Ended up returning it because it was different, but the fit was much better in the same size.

That is the OLD short sleeve shirt.

Back in the day...you had the long sleeve and the short sleeved shirts....in the 80's they introduced the "convertable" that is a short sleeve shirt that was basicly a long sleeved shirt with the sleeves cut off.

The shirt pictured has not top button, no epaletes.   As far as I know it is NOT authorised for wear. 

[a2capt]

Heh, missed the epaulets on the image I chose .. however, no- what I have seen in use is that collar, lay flat style, without the stand up portion of the construction, with epaulets, and the same pockets as we have now. One was bought from LA AFB about six weeks ago, a few cadets at last years HIWG encampment, and I've seen senior members at various Wing functions with them.

But all the times that I've gone in the store, I don't recall seeing anything other than LS & SS in DSCP and Propper.

[lordmonar]

HMMMMMM.....maybe a Coast Guard Shirt that snuck in by accident?

The CG service uniform is really really close to the USAF uniform.

[MIKE]

^ Coast Guard shirts are USAF shirts.

[ColonelJack]

When I wear a coat and tie, it's because someone's paying me to wear it.  (This does not count for uniform, of course.)

And there's nothing fashionably wrong with having pockets on a dress shirt.  Fie on these young'uns who say otherwise!

Jack

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

I never, ever wear a tie if I can get out of it.  The only tie I currently own is my Air Force/CAP tie.

I'm 48 years old and don't wear any of the pictured styles.  Wasn't the term in favour at one time "metrosexual" for such dress?  Very similar to the "preppies" of my youth...a dress style I also did not adopt.

My dad specified in his will that he was not to be buried in a tie.  He said when he was in the Army (back in the days when they had to tuck their tie into the top buttons of their shirt) he got quite good at tying his so that he could leave the top button open without getting caught.

[Private Investigator]

I'm sorry to tell you this, but your member's only jacket has also fallen out of fashion.

LMAO .. You know it is funny when coffeee comes out your nose   

[Private Investigator]

My wife loves M-F but I am a Saturday and Sunday kind of guy   

[Майор Хаткевич]

My wife loves M-F but I am a Saturday and Sunday kind of guy   

Underwear and a Tee?  :angel:

[Private Investigator]

Yes   

[Майор Хаткевич]

Yes   

[NIN]

BTW, after getting a closer look at that shirt, that is the EXACT kind of shirt I first got as a cadet in 1981.  the "wide-collar short-sleeve without epaulets" that was available at clothing sales still.

I think I wore that shirt for the better part of a year, and kept it for occasional wear until it was no longer authorized in late 1982 or early 1983.  That was the same style of shirt that you see in the old CAPM50-3 where the cadet Lt Col is modeled wearing short sleeve blues with shoulder board, not shoulder marks.

[ColonelJack]

SMs who wore that shirt wore the CAP cutout on the left collar and miniature metal rank on the right.  I remember wearing that shirt for a few months after I joined back in '81.

Jack

[a2capt]

BTW, after getting a closer look at that shirt, that is the EXACT kind of shirt I first got as a cadet in 1981.  the "wide-collar short-sleeve without epaulets" that was available at clothing sales still.

Except as I noted, what I've seen more recent is complete, and otherwise the same looking save for the wide collar, and does have a button at the top.

[Devil Doc]

is it sad that some of you have been in CAP since before I was born?

[ColonelJack]

is it sad that some of you have been in CAP since before I was born?

You could've gone all day and not said that ...   

Jack

[Garibaldi]

Some of us have been in CAP since before we were born...like, in utero...

[SarDragon]

Oh, Jack, you're so ancient. I'd already been in CAP 11 years when you graduated from HS. 

[NIN]

is it sad that some of you have been in CAP since before I was born?

My lawn. You should get off it.

[SarDragon]

is it sad that some of you have been in CAP since before I was born?

My lawn. You should get off it.

My lawn. You should get off it.