Service Cap for Color Guard?

[Abby.L]

My squadron has a color guard event coming up, and we had been planning on using service caps. We had seen plenty of color guards use service caps, and we even have before. But my commander just talked to the OIC saying that it's not within regs to wear the service cap if we're acting as a unit color guard. I'm not sure where he came up with this, but if you could find regs supporting, or not supporting our use of service caps, that would be greatly appreiciated. I'm trying to figure out my commander's logic. Thanks in advance!

[SarDragon]

My squadron has a color guard event coming up, and we had been planning on using service caps. We had seen plenty of color guards use service caps, and we even have before. But my commander just talked to the OIC saying that it's not within regs to wear the service cap if we're acting as a unit color guard. I'm not sure where he came up with this, but if you could find regs supporting, or not supporting our use of service caps, that would be greatly appreiciated. I'm trying to figure out my commander's logic. Thanks in advance!

Since you will be in a color guard, the only members who may wear the service cap are the cadet officers. Service cap wear by cadet airmen and NCOs is restricted to honor guard members.

From several locations in CAPM 39-1 - NOTE: Cadet NCOs and Airmen will not wear the service cap (EXCEPTION: Cadet honor guard members may wear service cap. See Chapter 3 for details).

[SAR-EMT1]

My squadron has a color guard event coming up, and we had been planning on using service caps. We had seen plenty of color guards use service caps, and we even have before. But my commander just talked to the OIC saying that it's not within regs to wear the service cap if we're acting as a unit color guard. I'm not sure where he came up with this, but if you could find regs supporting, or not supporting our use of service caps, that would be greatly appreiciated. I'm trying to figure out my commander's logic. Thanks in advance!

Since you will be in a color guard, the only members who may wear the service cap are the cadet officers. Service cap wear by cadet airmen and NCOs is restricted to honor guard members.

From several locations in CAPM 39-1 - NOTE: Cadet NCOs and Airmen will not wear the service cap (EXCEPTION: Cadet honor guard members may wear service cap. See Chapter 3 for details).

He beat me to it,  but yeah... What he said.

[Gwitkowski]

Ok what they all said is not entirely true, I'm the color guard commander for my squadron and to get service caps or berets you need to get permission from your wing commander. I had to do that to get our berets.

[ßτε]

Ok what they all said is not entirely true, I'm the color guard commander for my squadron and to get service caps or berets you need to get permission from your wing commander. I had to do that to get our berets.

The rules for service caps are not the same as the rule for berets. The wing commander may authorize berets for color guard, but service caps are authorized only for cadets for Honor Guard and cadet officers.

[Gwitkowski]

Like I said before that's not entirely true we have gotten permission to wear service caps for some events. I had spent like 60 or 70 hours studying the regs for the NCGC

[a2capt]

It is always entirely possible that someone can make a wrong decision, you know.

[lordmonar]

Having said that.....if you did ask your wing commander and he authorised it.......you are good to go.  The regional commander can take up the issue that the wing commander may or may not have authority to authorise the service cap for a color guard.

[titanII]

You can wear berets for Color Guard? What's the process/reasoning behind that? (just curious)

[PHall]

You can wear berets for Color Guard? What's the process/reasoning behind that? (just curious)

It looks cool...

[a2capt]

If you say so.
Looks like someone laid a muffin on a head, to me. Blech.

[Майор Хаткевич]

You can wear berets for Color Guard? What's the process/reasoning behind that? (just curious)

It looks hard kewl!!!11!!1111!!!1!111!!!1

Fixed it.

[a2capt]

I just don't get that hat anyway. Looks dopey, like it's sliding off your face. I can't help but want to straighten them before I realize it's supposed to look like that.

Ugh.

[SarDragon]

If you say so.
Looks like someone laid a muffin on a head, to me. Blech.

Not even as kool as this:

[titanII]

Back on topic... 
Is the beret meant for Color Guard Competitions, or can it be worn for any old Squadron Color Guard event? Does the Wing Commander authorize the beret for Color Guards in the entire wing, or on an individual squadron basis? (Again, just curious. I too would rather not have a hat that you have to shave, and looks like it's sliding off your head)

[Hawk200]

Back on topic... 
Is the beret meant for Color Guard Competitions, or can it be worn for any old Squadron Color Guard event? Does the Wing Commander authorize the beret for Color Guards in the entire wing, or on an individual squadron basis? (Again, just curious. I too would rather not have a hat that you have to shave, and looks like it's sliding off your head)

From 39-1: "Only blue berets may be authorized for special purpose wear. Berets provided at special activities may be worn at the activity ONLY." That's under "Table 1-3. Additional Items That May Be Authorized by the Wing/Region Commander."

That doesn't say that berets are specifically for a color guard, only that they are authorized for special purposes (although you will get the types that think that it's only authorized or means something from their activity, believing that their activity is the only one of importance.)

All in all, berets are a pain. They can look nice under certain circumstances, but if it's worn all the time, they can wear out, get dirty, and end up looking like trash (and that's being polite). Color guard is a good place for it, but it's not the only place.

[Abby.L]

Well, this certainly blew-up while I wasn't monitering it. Though the color guard is missed in time for different headwear, I have certainly learned that I can get authorization for some pretty good looking stuff. I still need to get a beret anyway.  :angel:

[Майор Хаткевич]

Well, this certainly blew-up while I wasn't monitering it. Though the color guard is missed in time for different headwear, I have certainly learned that I can get authorization for some pretty good looking stuff. I still need to get a beret anyway.  :angel:

Obviously a good looking dress up is the most important part of a Color Guard.

[Abby.L]

But of course. Would you want a color guard wearing the simplest of all uniforms? I know I wouldn't, I would want the audience to think that we represent more than that, and that we take the time to get that done.

[Hawk200]

But of course. Would you want a color guard wearing the simplest of all uniforms? I know I wouldn't, I would want the audience to think that we represent more than that, and that we take the time to get that done.

What do you think you represent "more" of? You represent Civil Air Patrol, and being different doesn't. You will have a few things that are different than the basic uniform, but it's not drastically different. Nor should it be.

[lordmonar]

But of course. Would you want a color guard wearing the simplest of all uniforms? I know I wouldn't, I would want the audience to think that we represent more than that, and that we take the time to get that done.

What do you think you represent "more" of? You represent Civil Air Patrol, and being different doesn't. You will have a few things that are different than the basic uniform, but it's not drastically different. Nor should it be.

That's one train of thought.

But one that does not follow the basic military pattern.

The color guard is supposed to be the biggest, baddest butt kickers in the the unit.  The are supposed to be the best of the best.....and elite units often if not always have some sort of distinctive uniform to set themselves apart from the regular members they represent.

[Eclipse]

The color guard is supposed to be the biggest, baddest butt kickers in the the unit.  The are supposed to be the best of the best.....and elite units often if not always have some sort of distinctive uniform to set themselves apart from the regular members they represent.

Um, what?  In most units the CG is the first 4 cadets who walked in the door that night.

[Eclipse]

But of course. Would you want a color guard wearing the simplest of all uniforms? I know I wouldn't, I would want the audience to think that we represent more than that, and that we take the time to get that done.

You should concentrate on doing it correctly and with the reverence and respect appropriate, and not worry about being "elite".
On more than one occasion I have seen cadets who invest all their energy in the accouterments and then struggle to perform the
ceremony.

[jimmydeanno]

The purpose of a color guard isn't to highlight the guard, but to highlight the Flag they carry.  It seems to me that the more circusy (made up word) that our uniform looks, the more it would detract from what the color guard is actually representing.

[a2capt]

I didn't see one Service Cap at NCC.

[MIKE]

I didn't see one Service Cap at NCC.

And I doubt you will 'cause CAPM 52-4 sets the uniform for competition.  Deviate from that standard and you get docked points.

[a2capt]

^^ Yup. I was hoping the cap wanter would miss that bit

[Eclipse]

So the "most elite" are the ones who are the "most uniform"?

Imagine that.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Nothing beats a Maroon Beret, bloused combat boots with white laces, and red ascots!

Git er done!

Or...just do what is in the regs, keeping the costs down and simplicity up, and focus on learning the skills.

[SarDragon]

There's an olde adage out there: "Form follows function." Get it working right first, then make it look pretty.

[Abby.L]

My color guard team had been practicing for a good month before the ceremony. Day of, we probably could have done it blind-folded. So we had that down. Now that we've deviated from the original question, it would have been nice to know that wing-approval is all that was needed for a different uniform item. Regardless, the original question posed by me was answered, so I thank you, Gentlemen.

[Майор Хаткевич]

Too bad a lesson wasn't learned here.

[lordmonar]

The color guard is supposed to be the biggest, baddest butt kickers in the the unit.  The are supposed to be the best of the best.....and elite units often if not always have some sort of distinctive uniform to set themselves apart from the regular members they represent.

Um, what?  In most units the CG is the first 4 cadets who walked in the door that night.

Supposed to be.

If your standards are that low....don't assume that everyone else's are.