Vanguard Letter from the National Commander

[JC004]

I'm happy to see that other people think the stuff they have is lame.  It's a shame Vanguard doesn't actually know what we want.  It's also a shame NHQ doesn't allow companies give us things that we want - like fabric strip tapes, better non-uniform stuff, freaking challenge coins, etc., etc.

Has Vanguard ever done a member survey?  Good companies like Starbucks do them all the time.  They say "Would you buy this?," "Is this type of item important to you?," etc.  Non-profits like the ASPCA and all have shops with cool stuff that their members would actually buy.

Screw the showers.  I'm all for the idea of allowing subordinate units to apply for grants that come from Vanguard funds to fund things that benefit us more.  Let a wing be able to buy SAR gear, a group to be able to buy supplies for AE outreach, etc., etc.

[a2capt]

I'm happy to see that other people think the stuff they have is lame.  It's a shame Vanguard doesn't actually know what we want.

Now...

It's also a shame NHQ doesn't allow companies give us things that we want - like fabric strip tapes, better non-uniform stuff, freaking challenge coins, etc., etc.

We are ...

Screw the showers.  I'm all for the idea of allowing subordinate units to apply for grants that come from Vanguard funds to fund things that benefit us more.  Let a wing be able to buy SAR gear, a group to be able to buy supplies for AE outreach, etc., etc.

Onto something!

Has Vanguard ever done a member survey?  Good companies like Starbucks do them all the time.  They say "Would you buy this?," "Is this type of item important to you?," etc.  Non-profits like the ASPCA and all have shops with cool stuff that their members would actually buy.

They do have this recent customer satisfaction survey that is still active .. perhaps some of these comments on the feedback block might get some attention ..

[davidsinn]

I ordered from VG ten days ago. Just some piddly little insignia I need for wing conference tomorrow. It just shipped today. That is very poor service.

[lordmonar]

I ordered from VG ten days ago. Just some piddly little insignia I need for wing conference tomorrow. It just shipped today. That is very poor service.

No not really.

Mail Order buisnesses typically use 4-6 weeks as their standard turn around time.

[davidsinn]

I ordered from VG ten days ago. Just some piddly little insignia I need for wing conference tomorrow. It just shipped today. That is very poor service.

No not really.

Mail Order buisnesses typically use 4-6 weeks as their standard turn around time.

None I've ever used. I've had computer parts installed less than 24 hours after I ordered using standard USPS shipping. Hock would be here in three to four days.

Per their own website it should have been in transit five to seven days ago:

If I placed my order today, how long before the order will ship?
  With  the large volume of items we ship daily, it normally takes 3-5 working  days before an order leaves the warehouse. Custom and personalized items may take an additional 7-10 working days. There are special  circumstances in which we will try to expedite your order. When asking for  special shipping, i.e. Overnight, Second or Third day, please keep in  mind these are methods of shipping only. Orders still require 3-5  working days to process.  PLEASE NOTE: Any items backordered will be shipped First Class Mail.

5 ea.	Civil Air Patrol - Bronze Triangle Ribbon Clasp	$3.25
2 ea.	Civil Air Patrol - Captain on Ultramarine Blue	$1.70
2 ea.	Civil Air Patrol - Senior Ground Team Cloth	$1.70
1 ea.	Civil Air Patrol - Olive Loop 4 By 12"	$2.35

That's my order. Nothing custom. Nothing they shouldn't have had stocked. It left the warehouse this morning. So recently that USPS hasn't even logged it into their system yet.

[lordmonar]

Maybe I'm just old.

As for your specific order....the quote says "normally" 3-5 buisness days. 

So let's do the math.

So...you ordered 10 days ago....13 April.

Two days for the week end....that is 8 days....so they missed their target ship day by 3 days.

Now they say normally.  What is normal?  Maybe....just maybe.....one of the items on your list was not available but was comming in soon...so they held your order until it was complete.

I don't think a 3 days slippage is "poor" performance.

[arajca]

Three days slippage for a stock order is poor performance.

Reputable companies will let you know if there are any issues with your order promptly and usually (98.7589% of the time) give you the option to either cancel the problem item(s), do a split ship, or wait for the entire order to ship at one time. Believe it or not, this included the Bookstore and CAPMart.

The few companies that I have had that poor performance with I no longer use.

[lordmonar]

Three days slippage for a stock order is poor performance.

Reputable companies will let you know if there are any issues with your order promptly and usually (98.7589% of the time) give you the option to either cancel the problem item(s), do a split ship, or wait for the entire order to ship at one time. Believe it or not, this included the Bookstore and CAPMart.

The few companies that I have had that poor performance with I no longer use.

That is true....according the FTC the standard is 30 days from time of receipt of the order.....so again....I question your categorisation of their performance as poor.

[arajca]

If a company says it'll be 3-5 days before shipping and waits ANOTHER 3 days to ship, they've broken their word to the customer. FTC standard may be the technical definition of poor performance, but a company that does not meet its own statements is not showing good perfomance, even it their performance does meet the technical definition of poor performance.

[RADIOMAN015]

I ordered from VG ten days ago. Just some piddly little insignia I need for wing conference tomorrow. It just shipped today. That is very poor service.

No not really.

Mail Order buisnesses typically use 4-6 weeks as their standard turn around time.

Maybe the late night TV ads for some "unique" items would be 4-6 weeks, but those are potential 'scammers" anyways, not normal mailhouse businesses that have "stock" items advertised on their website.

Other Vanguard "supporters" on the list seem to want to make excuses for Vanguard, in fact even Vanguard makes excuses for their "poor service" of 3 to 5 working days BEFORE AN ORDER SHIPS because they are SO busy !!!

As a good example of service  -- I called a mail order house to get a stock proprietary battery pack for one of my radio scanners/receivers that they carry on Moday mid-morning.  It shipped that afternoon and I got it the next day.  (Including an email notice stating the order had been processeded & another email stating it had shipped along with the tracking number.   That was what I expect as far as required service.   

IF any of the membership wants to continue to put up with Vanguard's poor service, than that's fine BUT personally I think everyone having a bad experience with Vanguard needs to file a complaint with Membership Services at National Headquarters
RM

[Short Field]

Admit it.  It doesn't matter what Vanguard or National does, some of you will NEVER be happy with Vanguard.

[FlyTiger77]

I ordered from VG ten days ago. Just some piddly little insignia I need for wing conference tomorrow. It just shipped today. That is very poor service.

No not really.

Mail Order businesses typically use 4-6 weeks as their standard turn around time.

Really? The vendors I frequently patronize usually ship to my door (ok, post office box) in a week to 10 days max. I remember 4-6 weeks back in the '70s and '80s, but certainly not in the last decade or so.

[jimmydeanno]

^Service time, this day in age is a big deal.  We aren't ordering from the Sears Roebuck Catalog.  I ordered some technology related items from a vendor shipping from CHINA and it got to me in 4 days with free shipping.

Vanguard makes nice high quality stuff.  Their representatives consistently say that CAP customers are the most demanding in their expectations, but they have made significant improvement over the last few years.

[tsrup]

Last time I heard, when a company "donates" heavily toward an organization and then becomes it's exclusive supplier, that was bad...

But on the flip side, this nonsense about "oh they took for ever on my order", c'mon..

I'm sure the  Hock had their problems too, and I'm sure there has been times where vanguard exceeded your expectations.     
Like last time I ordered my leather name patch, I expected at least 2 weeks for them to process my order (custom and all).  I received that patch in 5 days.  Unfortunately stories like that are going to be pushed aside whilst everyone grabs their pitchforks and torches..

So lets face it, there could be a real issue with the donations and the exclusivity, but dogpiling on with "they took 3 days longer that they said they Normaly take to process orders" isn't productive.

[RADIOMAN015]

Last time I heard, when a company "donates" heavily toward an organization and then becomes it's exclusive supplier, that was bad...

But on the flip side, this nonsense about "oh they took for ever on my order", c'mon..

So lets face it, there could be a real issue with the donations and the exclusivity, but dogpiling on with "they took 3 days longer that they said they Normaly take to process orders" isn't productive.

Really   Why don't you ask the many senior members (and even cadets) that need something for an upcoming event that didn't get it on time.    Lets face it when you deal with Vanguard you are spinning the guessing wheel as to when you will get you order. 
Only thing I can say is with the Hock Shop if you ordered it before lunch (and maybe after lunch) it got shipped to you THE SAME DAY!!!   
Stop making excuses for Vanguard, and since the leadership & paid administration at CAP created this problem in the first place (rather than a licensing agreement with The Hawk) they SHOULD take the heat EVERY time there's a problem with Vanguard.   
RM

[tdepp]

^For better or worse, The Hock Shop ship has sailed away until or unless they get a licensing agreement from CAP and they can return to port.  So, how about we concentrate on helping NHQ make our experience with Vanguard better?

[bosshawk]

Todd: good suggestion, but we have members who would rather [censored] than fix things.

[capchiro]

Gentlmen, Vanguard stocks a lot of the military clothing stores and handles orders from active duty all over the world from all of the services.  As such, I think they are doing okay with our stuff.  Perhaps you weren't around during the days of the bookstore, but things weren't any better then.  I have been happy with the items I have ordered and the time it took.  Maybe some members should plan ahead and not wait until the last minute to order items.  It is what it is.  Get over it or find some other volunteer group to join.  It is always amazing that the minority that are so unhappy with things can be so vocal.  It is also amazing that the same people P & M over everything.. 

[wingnut55]

 True :clap: :clap: :clap:

[RADIOMAN015]

So, how about we concentrate on helping NHQ make our experience with Vanguard better?

Todd,
It is simple, you call membership service and tell them about your experience with Vanguard. (There is someone at National Headquarters handling this monitoring).   BTW please compare it to what you normally experience when dealing with mail order retailers.  Maybe I've been lucky (as well as others posting) in those mail order retailers that I deal with seem to be able to ship same day or the next day at the latest on stock items.

My experience tells me that their is a problem with Vanguard in that they cannot maintain consistent processing time standards.  This may be due to not meeting contract requirements (e.g. not enough stock), inadequate staffing, or flawed processing procedures for special orders (e.g. name tags/plates) or a combination of all of these. 
RM