2007 Wreaths Across America

[badger bob]

Wreaths Across America and Civil Air Patrol join together to kick-off a National Sponsorship Campaign

MAXWELL AIR FORCE BASE, Ala. - 52 Civil Air Patrol wings will be participating in a partnership with Wreaths Across America in which the public will be provided a first-ever opportunity to sponsor the placement of holiday wreaths on veterans graves across the U.S. in 2007.

The Civil Air Patrol and Wreaths Across America will hold a press conference on Thursday, March 1, at 3:00 p.m. in the Madison Room at the Crystal Gateway Marriot in Arlington, Va., to kick off the 2007 Wreaths Across America project. The wreath-laying ceremonies will be held on Dec. 15, 2007.

Wreaths Across America began in 2006 as an offshoot of the Arlington National Cemetery wreath project, which was started in 1992 with the annual placement of wreaths donated by Worcester Wreath Co. of Harrington, Maine. The Wreaths Across America ceremonies were conducted largely by CAP wings and squadrons with the help of veterans' organizations; private citizens; the Maine State Society of Washington, D.C., which annually assists with the laying of wreaths at Arlington; and the Patriot Guard Riders, an organization consisting of nearly 80,000 motorcyclists whose primary mission is the attend the funeral of fallen heroes nationwide. In its first year, Wreaths Across America wreath-laying ceremonies were held at more than 240 national and state veterans' cemeteries across the country and in Puerto Rico.

In addition to sponsored wreaths, 10,000 holiday wreaths for Arlington National Cemetery and 4,000 holiday wreaths for ceremonies in all 50 states plus offshore veteran's cemeteries around the world will be donated by Worcester Wreath Co. in 2007. "Our mission is to remember the fallen, honor those who serve and teach our children the value of freedom," said Karen Worcester, Wreaths Across America executive director. "Thousands of CAP members last year participated and helped us to do just that, and this year's Wreaths Across America promises to take this worthwhile endeavor to even greater heights."

"CAP is a proud partner with Wreaths Across America," said CAP National Commander Maj. Gen. Antonio J. Pineda. "This project will provide citizens across the country the opportunity to join with CAP members in celebrating the freedom we all enjoy by honoring those who made it possible -- our fallen heroes."


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Just imagine the impact of hosting Arlington-like wreath-laying events at over 200 locations all around the Country! Last year we saw a tremendous reception with just the 6-ceremonial wreaths at each of the State and National veterans' cemeteries. But with the new 'Sponsor a Wreath' program, groups, businesses and individuals will now have the where-with-all to participate in the event on the same scale as what we've seen at Arlington over the last 15 years.
We've received emails, letters and calls from many interested parties asking to do just this very thing - and in partnership with Civil Air Patrol, Wreaths Across America is moving to meet this need.

And the greatest part is, the sponsorship will not only fund the laying of a wreaths on one or more headstones during the holidays, but will also provide for the other stated missions, to Honor; & Teach with outreach programs to both veterans and educational opportunities for children all around the Country.

For more information about the new National Sponsorship Campaign, check out the website at: www.wreaths-across-america.org

[ddelaney103]

It's a nice thing to do.  The only hangup I have is they don't put them on non-Christian headstones (they leave US flags instead).  Considering Christmas Wreaths are the adoption of a pre-Christian, Winter Solstice tradition, it seems a little odd.

I suppose they could put it on the Wiccan headstones as well, but since you can't have a VA headstone with a Wiccan symbol, I guess it's a moot point.

[badger bob]

I believe the intent of this program is to honor all servicemen and women without discrimination.

This is truly one of the more honorable programs that CAP can be involved in nationwide.

[LtCol White]

Since Xmas is a Christian celebration and the wreath is a symbol of this celebration, I think its appropriate that it only be placed on Christian graves. While some may see this as discriminatory, I think it respects those of the Non-Christian faiths. Perhaps a Jew, Muslim, or other would find it disrespectful of their traditions to have someone assume they want a Christian symbol placed on their grave. Placing an American flag seems an appropriate substitute because it makes no assumptions or impositions for those other faiths but it does show that they have been respected and not been forgotten or neglected because they aren't  Christian. It shows that even at the time of a Christian celebration, time is taken to remember those Non-Christians who made the same sacrifices as their Christian brothers in arms. Few veterans or families would object to having a flag placed on a grave.

I think the way this is handled is very appropriate and brings credit on all those involved.

[brasda91]

Just received this e-mail.  For those of you that have participated, how did you present this to your friends and family members?  Print off some pictures and describe the ceremony, ask for a donation and then send in the multiple checks along with your form?

Veterans of Kentucky and the Nation
To be Honored by the CAP in
2nd Annual Wreath Laying Ceremony
December 15, 2007 12 noon EST

Dear Squadron Commander:

We at Wreaths Across America invite you, your squadron, and their families to attend a wreath laying ceremony at any local veterans' cemetery. Seven wreaths, one representing each branch of the military and POW/MIA, have been donated to each cemetery.

This year nearly 15,000 wreaths will be donated by Worcester Wreath Company, 10,000 of which are destined for Arlington National Cemetery, doubling last year's donation. The generous donation of all these wreaths will be made by Worcester Wreath Company of Harrington, Maine who has enjoyed the privilege of placing the wreaths on the graves of veterans at Arlington.

The placement of the wreaths at Arlington has created a breathtaking scene of rows upon rows of red and green since 1992. Those who see it claim they will never forget. The event has inspired many to strive to create a similar experience in their local veterans' cemeteries. This is also a great community service opportunity for your unit to participate in.

This year Worcester Wreath has contracted with Wreaths Across America to provide up to an additional 500,000 wreaths nationally in effort to create the Arlington experience at veterans' cemeteries all over the country. The wreaths will be made on an as needed basis, dictated by the number of sponsorships sold. That's 2500 wreaths at each participating cemetery.

**THERE ARE 7 WEEKS LEFT TO COLLECT ALL SPONSORSHIPS**

As you know, we enjoy our freedoms because of the sacrifices of our veterans. Read on for WHY and HOW your squadron can remember and honor them with your participation:

WHY

There are 22 CAP Squadrons in Kentucky; there are 8 Kentucky cemeteries participating; there are 2,500 wreaths available for sponsorship for each location, therefore your squadron would need to sell 908 sponsorships. This means $1816.00 raised for your squadron.

The squadron member selling the most sponsorships in the country wins an all expense paid trip to Washington, DC to participate in the 2007 Arlington ceremony.
The squadron selling the most sponsorships in the country will chose a member and a guest for an all expense paid trip to Washington, DC to also participate in the 2007 ceremony there.




HOW

Easy Steps   Comments
1. Divide WAA pins among squadron members. Print as many sponsorship forms as needed.    It is not necessary to give each sponsor a pin. However, more pins are available from WAA. Sponsorship forms can be downloaded and printed from the National CAP website.
2. Mobilize squadron members into the community to solicit sponsorships.   See instructional video on the National CAP website. Each sponsorship is $15.
3. Raise money for your squadron and to remember and honor our veterans.   Mail all funds ($15.00 for each sponsorship) to Wreaths Across America PO Box 256 Harrington. ME 04643
4. Your squadron receives $2.00 for every sponsorship sold.   Wreaths Across America will send $2.00 for every sponsorship to CAP National Headquarters. National Headquarters will then disperse funds to your squadron.


We apologize for the length of this email, but hope it helps clarify the process. In order to help us prepare for and organize this tremendous event, we ask for the favor of clicking on the following link. There it will take you approximately 2 minutes to answer 10-12 questions regarding your squadron. Please answer the brief survey questions, EVEN IF YOUR SQUADRON IS NOT ABLE TO PARTICIPATE. This will allow us to try and make alternate arrangements for the cemeteries in your area.

https://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=u8XSODiKpP585G2xPBq71w_3d_3d

The following information may also be helpful. It may aid in coordination for you to be in touch with the WAA Director in your area. However, it is not necessary for you to contact the WAA Director for each location.


Name of Cemetery   WAA Director   Phone   Email
Kentucky Veterans Cemetery, West Hopkinsville   Capt Wilson Polidura   

Lebanon National Cemetery, Lebanon   Hayden Johnson   

Cove Hill National Cemetery, Louisville   Walt Oster   

Zachary Taylor National Cemetery, Louisville   

Lexington National Cemetery, Lexington   Julie Curry   

Camp Nelson National Cemetery, Nicholasville   Julie Curry   

Danville National Cemetery, Danville   Steve Verrigni   

Mill Springs National Cemetery, Nancy   


Not only is this a great way for your squadron to raise funds, but the CAP will be responsible for placing wreaths on up to 500,000 veterans' graves all over this great country.  Be part of this important mission!

Sincerely,
Civil Air Patrol Project Officers


Major Wayne Merritt (207) 483-2039 wayne@wreathsacrossamerica.org
Major Dennis Murray (207) 427-3421 dmurray1@verizon.net

[jimmydeanno]

Great program, I've sold about $600.00 worth of these things already...I'm glad they extended the original deadline...

[brasda91]

Great program, I've sold about $600.00 worth of these things already...I'm glad they extended the original deadline...

Thanks awesome.  Can you give us some tips/pointers on how you have presented the program?  How have you been successful ?

[jimmydeanno]

Our squadron PAO first presented the program to our squadron noting that CAP had partnered with WAA and made note of the financial benefits the squadron would get out of it.

We got a donation form and I ran with it from there.

I found the copy of the Volunteer online that had the article about it, made a PDF that has only that article and printed a few to hand out when I asked for the donations.

For the most part, I started about a month ago with co-workers and family friends asking if they'd like to sponsor at least one - that got about 10 sold.

Then I thought to myself, heck, I can do better than this and went to some small local businesses.  This was good because small businesses and sole props.  like tax deductions and like being known in the community for supporting local groups (baseball, football, CAP, etc).  I've found this works best with small construction companies, and other 'trade' type businesses.

So, wearing my Polo Shirt combo and my best smile, I spoke to the owners, told them what the program was about and asked for the donation.  I specifically noted how it a) honors fallen soldiers b) helps youth gain a respect and understanding of sacrifice and c) helps to support local activities as well as the national effort.

With that approach, I've received 5 small business donations @ $90 each.  Of course in the routine I've been rejected numerous times.  But as with any sales type thing, you just need to press on.

The cadets in the squadron are working pretty hard doing this too and a few have sold about 5 wreaths, but younger cadets have a hard time selling anything because they can't answer a lot of the questions or think "on the fly" like our more seasoned members.  However, we talked to them all, told them points to focus on - told them to cry to seal the deal... (just kidding)

It also helps if the people selling them actually support the cause. 

I asked my mother if she wanted to sponsor one, she sponsored 5  because she believed in the cause.  It also helped that her husband, my stepfather, was a Navy Vet and died a few years back.  He is buried in a Veteran Cemetery and she thought it would be nice to do something like this.

I'd like to cap it off with a corporate donation ($1,000) but it's tough...I think I can do it though

[RogueLeader]

^ a definite Bravo Zulu, and a Hooah.

[Eclipse]

Wreath ceremonies to honor veterans Dec. 15

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123078668

[RogueLeader]

I'm helping with ours, and glad to be doing it.

[Slim]

My unit started participating back in August, as a way to replace our single annual fundraiser (that we temporarily lost).  At first, it was all about the money, and making up the $1000 we lost from the other deal.

So, we sold about 150 wreaths on our own at a couple of different fairs.  What really blew the door open was giving a presentation at a meeting for a police officer's association.  That one meeting got us invited to two other meetings, went to those two and were invited to more, until we made about 20 presentations to different service clubs:  three different police officer's associations, the largest AmVets post in the metro Detroit area, two American Legion posts (which was really six, considering that both of them also had their AL auxiliary and Sons of the AL meetings at the same time), two different motorcycle club chapters (the club is exclusively for police officers and firefighters).  I don't honestly remember off the top of my head how many places we went to.  I say "We" collectively, most of the work was done by my unit commander, while I stayed back to run the squadron for him.

Each of these presentations brought out a story.  The one AmVets post we went to had recently lost a member of their Son's of AmVets in Iraq.  One of the motorcycle club members told us of his three sons-one of which was a former CAP cadet.  One is a Blackhawk pilot in Iraq, another was getting ready to mob for Iraq, and the third had just finished IET/OSUT, and his first duty unit has warning orders to go to Iraq in the spring.  He was looking at the reality of having all three of his sons there at the same time.

As these presentations went on, the stories got to be quite an emotional burden.  Before we knew it, this project wasn't about the money anymore; it was about the message, and never forgetting the sacrifices made.

We still did ok, we ended up selling 527 of them.

Last Wednesday, my unit commander (and room mate) took over as the site coordinator for the national cemetary in our area.  There were still quite a few things left to be done, and we've (my roommates wife is also a member) been throwing most of our spare time at getting this thing off the ground.  We're expecting 200-300 people out there on Saturday.

I have a special mission I've taken on for Saturday.  Just before Thanksgiving, I received a note on one of the social networking sites that was a first hand account from an ANG honor guard troop.  He performed a funeral for a veteran the week before Thanksgiving, with no family present (the only attendees were him and his partner, 8 guys from VFW to perform the rifle salute and play taps, and the kid who drove the hearse).  This veteran had no family, nobody to present the flag to, and was buried in a cardboard box!  I've made it my mission to make sure this gentleman has a wreath on his grave this year.

We're already starting on Wreaths Across America 2008.  One of the state veterans commissions contacted us asking if it was too late to make a donation for this year.  They've already committed to sponsoring 1000 wreaths for next year.

[jimmydeanno]

^Way to go Slim!  That is awesome! 

[off topic]Just out of curiosity, what was your single annual fundraiser that lost you $1,000?[/off topic]

[LtCol White]

It's a nice thing to do.  The only hangup I have is they don't put them on non-Christian headstones (they leave US flags instead).  Considering Christmas Wreaths are the adoption of a pre-Christian, Winter Solstice tradition, it seems a little odd.

I suppose they could put it on the Wiccan headstones as well, but since you can't have a VA headstone with a Wiccan symbol, I guess it's a moot point.

Actually I saw where a wiccan headstone was approved by VA.

[ddelaney103]

It's a nice thing to do.  The only hangup I have is they don't put them on non-Christian headstones (they leave US flags instead).  Considering Christmas Wreaths are the adoption of a pre-Christian, Winter Solstice tradition, it seems a little odd.

I suppose they could put it on the Wiccan headstones as well, but since you can't have a VA headstone with a Wiccan symbol, I guess it's a moot point.

Actually I saw where a wiccan headstone was approved by VA.

Yes.  That quote was from close to a year ago - they changed it since then.

Though the wreaths are still only for Christians...

[Psicorp]

It's a nice thing to do.  The only hangup I have is they don't put them on non-Christian headstones (they leave US flags instead).  Considering Christmas Wreaths are the adoption of a pre-Christian, Winter Solstice tradition, it seems a little odd.

I suppose they could put it on the Wiccan headstones as well, but since you can't have a VA headstone with a Wiccan symbol, I guess it's a moot point.

Actually I saw where a wiccan headstone was approved by VA.

Yes.  That quote was from close to a year ago - they changed it since then.

Though the wreaths are still only for Christians...

I find it amusing that so many things are considered "Christian" now that started out being from another religion (Easter, Christmas Day, Christmas trees, wreaths, Halloween alternative 'Fall Festivals', just to name a few).   I had no idea they weren't putting wreaths on EVERY grave.   I'm firing off a letter to the organization.

[ddelaney103]

It's a nice thing to do.  The only hangup I have is they don't put them on non-Christian headstones (they leave US flags instead).  Considering Christmas Wreaths are the adoption of a pre-Christian, Winter Solstice tradition, it seems a little odd.

I suppose they could put it on the Wiccan headstones as well, but since you can't have a VA headstone with a Wiccan symbol, I guess it's a moot point.

Actually I saw where a wiccan headstone was approved by VA.

Yes.  That quote was from close to a year ago - they changed it since then.

Though the wreaths are still only for Christians...

I find it amusing that so many things are considered "Christian" now that started out being from another religion (Easter, Christmas Day, Christmas trees, wreaths, Halloween alternative 'Fall Festivals', just to name a few).   I had no idea they weren't putting wreaths on EVERY grave.   I'm firing off a letter to the organization.

They mention it on their website (Question 6):

http://www.wreaths-across-america.org/faqs.html

[LtCol White]

I dont really see it as discriminatory. The wreath has come to symbolize Christmas. By putting a flag, they are showing that the non christians are not forgotten and they are respecting their non-christian beliefs.

In the society in which we live, we all know SOMEONE would file a lawsuit claiming offense if a wreath was put on their relative's non-christian grave even if it WAS done out of respect. Its sad but true and I'm sure this probably why they don't do it.

This being said, if there was a way to attach a symbol of the religion on the ribbon, it might fly. eg: Star of David for Jews, Pentagram for Wiccan, Crescent for muslim, etc...

[ddelaney103]

I dont really see it as discriminatory. The wreath has come to symbolize Christmas. By putting a flag, they are showing that the non christians are not forgotten and they are respecting their non-christian beliefs.

In the society in which we live, we all know SOMEONE would file a lawsuit claiming offense if a wreath was put on their relative's non-christian grave even if it WAS done out of respect. Its sad but true and I'm sure this probably why they don't do it.

This being said, if there was a way to attach a symbol of the religion on the ribbon, it might fly. eg: Star of David for Jews, Pentagram for Wiccan, Crescent for muslim, etc...

The difficulty is once you start dabbling in religion, you find the pastoral fields are liberally laced with mines.

I can just as easily see some Christian relative pitching a fit for putting a wreath - not every sect is big on Christmas or wreaths.  Because of the combination of pagan customs and profane revelry, Christmas celebrations were banned in places like Williamsburg back in colonial times.

I know WAA means well, but I sometimes wonder if this should be such a headline mission for CAP.

[Psicorp]

I guess I've never really considered a wreath as being a religious symbol.  It just makes sense to use wreaths in Winter...flowers don't usually grow and wreath materials are pretty easy to come by (not to mention last longer).

What I wonder is how much of the placement instructions is due to a fear of offending the  fallen and their families and how much is a fear of offending those who are placing the wreaths.   

[LtCol White]

As I said, thats why I think the flag is an acceptable substitute for the non-christian graves. They are remembered but not offended by placing the flag. It shows respect for their beliefs and is inclusive in the rememberence thoughts.

[Slim]

^Way to go Slim!  That is awesome! 

[off topic]Just out of curiosity, what was your single annual fundraiser that lost you $1,000?[/off topic]

Thanks!  Again, I can't take sole credit for doing the hard work.  Most of the clubs we went to meet on Tuesdays, which is our meeting night.  So, the boss went and sold sponsorships while I stayed and ran the shop for him.  I did make it to one presentation, and it was a pretty moving experience.  It was a Fraternal Order of Police meeting, that lodge covers about 6 different departments.  We gave the presentation, and passed out the materials then stood back.  They passed the hat around the room and we sold about 12, and had a few people come up afterwards to purchase them individually.  One of them was an officer who dropped a hundred dollar bill in front of us and all he wanted in return was my signature on the receipt.

[OT]  We did crowd control/etc at a large art fair every fall.  Four days, around the clock.  It usually took our unit and 2-3 others to have enough bodies to do everything.  We brought in as much as $2000 and as little as $1500 every year.  By the time we pay for food (which we provide), and kick some in to the other units, we usually brought in $1000-1500 every year.  They tried something differently this year, which failed miserably.  They gave us a booth to sell wreaths for the weekend, and the director of the fair was asking us about coming back by noon on Saturday.[/OT]

[brasda91]

Thanks!  Again, I can't take sole credit for doing the hard work.  Most of the clubs we went to meet on Tuesdays, which is our meeting night.  So, the boss went and sold sponsorships while I stayed and ran the shop for him. 

I'm curious why you don't take your squadron to the presentations?  Or at least a few squared-away cadets?  I'm thinking that having a few cadets would show the clubs the respect they have in remembrance for the fallen.

Like I say, I'm not knocking your ways, I like what your squadron has done.  I will plan on trying to replicate the same thing and was wondering if having cadets attend the presentations would be a benefit.

[Slim]

Thanks!  Again, I can't take sole credit for doing the hard work.  Most of the clubs we went to meet on Tuesdays, which is our meeting night.  So, the boss went and sold sponsorships while I stayed and ran the shop for him. 

I'm curious why you don't take your squadron to the presentations?  Or at least a few squared-away cadets?  I'm thinking that having a few cadets would show the clubs the respect they have in remembrance for the fallen.

Like I say, I'm not knocking your ways, I like what your squadron has done.  I will plan on trying to replicate the same thing and was wondering if having cadets attend the presentations would be a benefit.

Honestly, our squadron is in a rebuilding phase at the moment.  We lost four cadets, including our cadet commander to college, had a few more drop out for personal reasons, and we were left with four participating cadets, three of whom were going through the Great Start/CBT program.  Our current cadet commander just got promoted to C/SSgt.  She's a sharp troop, but I wouldn't really call her squared away.  Plus, she was running the CBT program with our leadership officer.

Another minor consideration is that most of our seniors are in public safety.  I'm a firefighter/EMT, the commander is a paramedic, LeadO is a police dispatcher, another senior is a former EMS dispatcher, and we have another who just graduated as a paramedic with a fire science degree, and is currently job hunting.  Not saying others are not worthy, we also have a retired phone company employee, a 747 pilot, and an engineer for Chrysler in our ranks.  What helped us a lot with some of the groups is that we all share that common brotherhood of service, and we speak the same language.

Not saying we may not try sending a cadet or two out next year, we just didn't have a spare cadet or two to send.

[brasda91]

Thanks!  Again, I can't take sole credit for doing the hard work.  Most of the clubs we went to meet on Tuesdays, which is our meeting night.  So, the boss went and sold sponsorships while I stayed and ran the shop for him. 

I'm curious why you don't take your squadron to the presentations?  Or at least a few squared-away cadets?  I'm thinking that having a few cadets would show the clubs the respect they have in remembrance for the fallen.

Like I say, I'm not knocking your ways, I like what your squadron has done.  I will plan on trying to replicate the same thing and was wondering if having cadets attend the presentations would be a benefit.

Honestly, our squadron is in a rebuilding phase at the moment.  We lost four cadets, including our cadet commander to college, had a few more drop out for personal reasons, and we were left with four participating cadets, three of whom were going through the Great Start/CBT program.  Our current cadet commander just got promoted to C/SSgt.  She's a sharp troop, but I wouldn't really call her squared away.  Plus, she was running the CBT program with our leadership officer.

Another minor consideration is that most of our seniors are in public safety.  I'm a firefighter/EMT, the commander is a paramedic, LeadO is a police dispatcher, another senior is a former EMS dispatcher, and we have another who just graduated as a paramedic with a fire science degree, and is currently job hunting.  Not saying others are not worthy, we also have a retired phone company employee, a 747 pilot, and an engineer for Chrysler in our ranks.  What helped us a lot with some of the groups is that we all share that common brotherhood of service, and we speak the same language.

Not saying we may not try sending a cadet or two out next year, we just didn't have a spare cadet or two to send.

Great.  Thanks.  I feel your pain.

[Lancer]

Greeting's All,

Just wanted to share our photos, here is a link to a photo gallery from today's Wreaths Across America Ceremony in Grand Rapids, MI at Chapel Hill Memorial Gardens.

http://picasaweb.google.com/mlcurtis69/WreathsAcrossAmerica2007ChapelHillMemorialGardens

Enjoy!

[mikeylikey]

^ They look great.  Thanks!

[RRLE]

Since CAP is mentioned, I thought you guys would want to see this story. It is part of Wreaths Across America.

"Ceremony in Lake Worth lagoon honors servicemen and women lost at sea" http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/palmbeach/sfl-1216ceremony,0,2140025.story

The places where CAP is mentioned:

Riviera Beach The small boat bobbed up and down in the rough sea. Still, Civil Air Patrol Col. S. Buddy Harris, Navy corpsman Tony Acosta and Marine veteran Ed Weber didn't budge. The three stood firmly at the stern of a Coast Guard utility boat while they tossed three wreaths in the water Saturday for those who lost their lives defending their country at sea.

It was the first ceremony of its kind at sea for the men and women of the Lake Worth Inlet Coast Guard Station. The spot was chosen because of its significance for Merchant MarineÖ and Civil Air Patrol veterans, who lost comrades at seas in World War II and who are often overlooked at veterans ceremonies and memorials.

"We are talking about thousands who were killed at sea," said Civil Air Patrol Maj. Virginia Knudsen. "Civil Air Patrol pilots would fly off the coast of Lantana."

Knudsen said Merchant Mariners transported troops during World War II. The men were the targets of German submarines stationed off the coast of the United States. Civil Air Patrol pilots, often private pilots who understood the need for homeland security, flew off the eastern coast of Lantana scouting the area for German U-boats and alerting Coast Guard boats who would then bomb the enemy ships.

Harris, 80, was one of them. In 1941 he was a Civil Air Patrol submarine chaser, flying coastal patrols protecting the shore from Nazi U-boats. The submarine chasers located 173 submarines, dived on 57, dropped 82 bombs and sank 2 subs, officials said Saturday. Harris said it's a small piece of history that is often overlooked.

"This ceremony will stimulate remembering all of the great souls who gave their lives in defense of our country," Harris said. said. "And hopefully make youngsters aware of that."

[Gunner C]

I looked at the pictures and stories of several places across the country and they were great - except for the activities at Arlington.  It appeared that about half of the cadets were in BDUs.

I could see a small detail of cadets who were handing out wreaths in that uniform, but they were everywhere!

As a veteran, I'm VERY offended.

That is sacred ground.  With very few exceptions, the uniform there should have been service dress.  PERIOD.

That is not a place for grubbies.  PERIOD.  On such sacred ground only the best uniforms should be worn.

Wearing BDUs there shows a COMPLETE LACK OF UNDERSTANDING OF MILITARY TRADITION.  PERIOD.

The wing commander (and possibly higher if complicit) should be relieved NOW.  PERIOD.

I'm considering quitting CAP right now.  This is the most offended I've been since I first put on a CAP uniform 40 years ago.  What the hell has happened to our organization?  Do these blisterheads understand what they've done?

Lt Col Hawkeye Pierce

[davedove]

Excuse me if I'm wrong, but I thought the active duty folks who perform the detail of putting the little flags on the graves wore BDU's for that duty.

[ddelaney103]

I looked at the pictures and stories of several places across the country and they were great - except for the activities at Arlington.  It appeared that about half of the cadets were in BDUs.

I could see a small detail of cadets who were handing out wreaths in that uniform, but they were everywhere!

As a veteran, I'm VERY offended.

That is sacred ground.  With very few exceptions, the uniform there should have been service dress.  PERIOD.

That is not a place for grubbies.  PERIOD.  On such sacred ground only the best uniforms should be worn.

Wearing BDUs there shows a COMPLETE LACK OF UNDERSTANDING OF MILITARY TRADITION.  PERIOD.

The wing commander (and possibly higher if complicit) should be relieved NOW.  PERIOD.

I'm considering quitting CAP right now.  This is the most offended I've been since I first put on a CAP uniform 40 years ago.  What the hell has happened to our organization?  Do these blisterheads understand what they've done?

Lt Col Hawkeye Pierce

The Third US Infantry (The Old Guard - perhaps you've heard of them?) plants flags before Memorial Day in ACU's (http://www.army.mil/oldguard/photos.htm Check the entry "Flags in 2007" under the May 2007 listing.

Once you've had the Regimental Commander and the commander of the Military District of Washington relieved for their grave offense, get back to us.

Until then, find a locker to stow your attitude.  I have misgivings about the WAA program, but the Cadets willing to give up a Saturday to plant wreaths in miserable winter weather don't deserve to be slapped around by cranky, uninformed veterans such as yourself.

[Lancer]

Once you've had the Regimental Commander and the commander of the Military District of Washington relieved for their grave offense, get back to us.

...nice play on words. 

I have misgivings about the WAA program...

Care to share? I'd actually like to hear what you have to say that could possibly be negative about this event.

[ddelaney103]

Care to share? I'd actually like to hear what you have to say that could possibly be negative about this event.

It's back on pg 1, but I'll recap here.

The cemeteries made the decision to only place wreaths on grave sites that have a Christian marking or on marking on the headstones (http://www.wreaths-across-america.org/faqs.html - bottom of page).  This implies a couple of assumptions:

All Christians and non denominationals are OK with Christmas wreaths.

All non Christians are not.

Both of these might be a bit rash.  I approve of honoring veterans, but have misgivings with honor veterans differently based on religion.

[ColonelJack]

The Third US Infantry (The Old Guard - perhaps you've heard of them?) plants flags before Memorial Day in ACU's (http://www.army.mil/oldguard/photos.htm Check the entry "Flags in 2007" under the May 2007 listing.

While I agree with much of what you said, I also take some exception to wearing anything but service dress at Arlington.  (Sorry, it's my opinion, and I'm sticking with it.)  A military cemetery is simply not the place for utility uniforms, and the fact that the Third Infantry did it in ACUs doesn't make it right.

My opinion, free and worth what it cost.  Your mileage may vary.

Jack

[jimmydeanno]

I think it is absolutely disgraceful.  The last time I was at Arlington, the gentlemen that was mowing the lawn was wearing shorts and a t-shirt. What a disgrace - he should have been fired.








I can't believe that people would recommend/demand that those laying thousands of sap covered, needle covered, dirty wreaths trecking through the snow, should wear their Sunday best.

[Slim]

I think it is absolutely disgraceful.  The last time I was at Arlington, the gentlemen that was mowing the lawn was wearing shorts and a t-shirt. What a disgrace - he should have been fired.








I can't believe that people would recommend/demand that those laying thousands of sap covered, needle covered, dirty wreaths trecking through the snow, should wear their Sunday best.

What we told people is to wear whichever uniform they had that was proper, including jackets.  If they had the proper outerwear to be warm enough in service dress, that was fine.  If people couldn't do that, we told them to wear BDUs.  Lacking proper outerwear for that uniform, we told people to dress in layers underneath their BDU shirt.

Our bottom line was that we wanted people to be in a proper uniform, and warm.  We did everything-including the ceremony-outside, with temps in the low 20s, 20 MPH winds, and blowing snow.  Surprisingly enough, I did not see one civilian jacket on any CAP member there.

Edit:  By the way, the director at our cemetery told us it was ok to put a wreath on any grave, regardless of religion.  Of course, we were only dealing with Christian and Jewish graves, not sure what would have happened with others.

[jimmydeanno]

Chris,

I think that what you guys did was absolutely fabulous.  Honoring American veterans - that was the purpose.  Having the cadets get out there and honor those who sacrificed themselves for this wonderful country.  Thank you for taking the time to do this - I appreciate it.

Jimmy.

-------------------------
Of course my comment was completely tounge-in-cheek because I am realistic and wouldn't expect those that were doing a work detail to wear a tuxedo regardless of whether they had one or not.

I brought this thread up to a friend of mine last night and we both strongly agreed that some of the comments here are what are disgraceful, not what the wreath layers did.  There is no disgrace in honoring veterans.

[davedove]

The Third US Infantry (The Old Guard - perhaps you've heard of them?) plants flags before Memorial Day in ACU's (http://www.army.mil/oldguard/photos.htm Check the entry "Flags in 2007" under the May 2007 listing.

While I agree with much of what you said, I also take some exception to wearing anything but service dress at Arlington.  (Sorry, it's my opinion, and I'm sticking with it.)  A military cemetery is simply not the place for utility uniforms, and the fact that the Third Infantry did it in ACUs doesn't make it right.

My opinion, free and worth what it cost.  Your mileage may vary.

Jack

I would agree if it were a ceremony at a single location within Arlington.  That way, the area could have been prepared so that the elements weren't such a big factor.  But for an activity like this, walking all over the cemetery, I think the BDU's would be more appropriate.

Of course, this is all just our opinions.

[LtCol White]

There is a nice article and video of the ceremony on the USAF webpage. Video has comment from Gen Courter and one of the younger cadets.

www.af.mil

[LtCol White]

I looked at the pictures and stories of several places across the country and they were great - except for the activities at Arlington.  It appeared that about half of the cadets were in BDUs.

I could see a small detail of cadets who were handing out wreaths in that uniform, but they were everywhere!

As a veteran, I'm VERY offended.

That is sacred ground.  With very few exceptions, the uniform there should have been service dress.  PERIOD.

That is not a place for grubbies.  PERIOD.  On such sacred ground only the best uniforms should be worn.

Wearing BDUs there shows a COMPLETE LACK OF UNDERSTANDING OF MILITARY TRADITION.  PERIOD.

The wing commander (and possibly higher if complicit) should be relieved NOW.  PERIOD.

I'm considering quitting CAP right now.  This is the most offended I've been since I first put on a CAP uniform 40 years ago.  What the hell has happened to our organization?  Do these blisterheads understand what they've done?

Lt Col Hawkeye Pierce

I AM VERY OFFENDED by your attitude towards the cadets participating in this activity.

As pointed out, Reg Military performs the same tasks in BDU's on many occasions.

LOOK at the weather the day this was done. Blues are HARDLY appropriate for spending hours in the cold and wet walking through the grass to put out these wreaths (So we throw safety out of the window?).

The cadets are performing a work task. They are NOT acting as an Honor Guard. The Ceremony at the USAF Memorial WAS done in blues by the Honor Guard. And an EXTREMELY nice job at that!

I think your tone and attitude towards this activity is highly uncalled for and unprofessional.

Did YOU participate in honoring the veterans in any of the wreath layings with cadets?

[Slim]

Chris,

I think that what you guys did was absolutely fabulous.  Honoring American veterans - that was the purpose.  Having the cadets get out there and honor those who sacrificed themselves for this wonderful country.  Thank you for taking the time to do this - I appreciate it.

Jimmy.

-------------------------
Of course my comment was completely tounge-in-cheek because I am realistic and wouldn't expect those that were doing a work detail to wear a tuxedo regardless of whether they had one or not.

I brought this thread up to a friend of mine last night and we both strongly agreed that some of the comments here are what are disgraceful, not what the wreath layers did.  There is no disgrace in honoring veterans.

Sorry, Jimmy.  I guess I shouldn't have quoted you.  Your post wasn't the one I was taking issue with or commenting on.

I'll take BDUs and warm over Blues and freezing any day of the week, and twice on the second or third Saturday of December any time. 

When we get our pictures developed and scanned, I'll snag a few to post.

I guess what really kind of disappoints me is that all of us (CAP, VFW, PGR, etc.) did all that work on Saturday, and got nine inches of snow dumped on us Saturday night.  So, now all those wreaths are buried until spring.  Oh well, we all know what we did, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat.

[RogueLeader]

It turns out that our squadron made the news for Lawton.

[alice]

About two weeks ago, I noticed a blurb in the Washington Post asking for volunteers to help remove the "thousands of wreaths ... left in December on graves in the [Arlington] cemetery's section 33."  Wondering if CAP's Wreaths Across America program includes helping to remove the dried up wreaths.  Telephonme number given for volunteers to help at Arlington was 703-607-8574.

[mikeylikey]

^ I never even thought about the removal issue.  I remember a program on TV about 10 years ago that said the cemetery employees nearly 50-60 people just to remove articles left at gravesites everyday.  Wouldn't this be part of their duty. 

I would also like to see prisoners do this.  In PA, federal Penn prisoners are routinely found in the National Cemeteries in the State cleaning them up, cutting grass, fixing things.  This would be a perfect job for other prisoners in the DC area!

[Slim]

We were asked by the cemetery director to bring a few people back in March or April to remove and dispose of them once the ground thaws. 

[captrncap]

My squadron is participating this year (1st time).

A member asked if the squadron gets $5 per wreath, where does the other $10 go?

Anyone know?

It would also be nice if I could respond to the person off the street

[jimmydeanno]

My squadron is participating this year (1st time).

A member asked if the squadron gets $5 per wreath, where does the other $10 go?

Anyone know?

It would also be nice if I could respond to the person off the street

Pretty sure it goes to the cost of wreath production and shipping.  IIRC, they produce them at cost ~$10.