Senior Member can't wear his NRA Marksman award?

[williamburdge]

I heard through my squadron and read in the new 39-1 that NRA marksmanship qualification awards are now authorized for wear on the service uniform.  I go to check and I see that it is authorized for cadets only, even though the qualification program spans all ages http://goo.gl/sN8Rmh (page 2).  Why is it that a senior member can't wear a qualification badge, and hypothetically would a cadet full colonel with a Distinguished Expert qualification badge, who turns 21 and must become a senior member, be ordered to remove his or her badge upon promotion?

With the old "youth" marksman program I have read about here, this regulation may have made sense if adults didn't qualify in youth shooting quals in the first place, but with the new NRA program this doesn't seem to make any sense.

Is that really what 39-1 stipulates?

[Alaric]

I heard through my squadron and read in the new 39-1 that NRA marksmanship qualification awards are now authorized for wear on the service uniform.  I go to check and I see that it is authorized for cadets only, even though the qualification program spans all ages http://goo.gl/sN8Rmh (page 2).  Why is it that a senior member can't wear a qualification badge, and hypothetically would a cadet full colonel with a Distinguished Expert qualification badge, who turns 21 and must become a senior member, be ordered to remove his or her badge upon promotion?

With the old "youth" marksman program I have read about here, this regulation may have made sense if adults didn't qualify in youth shooting quals in the first place, but with the new NRA program this doesn't seem to make any sense.

Is that really what 39-1 stipulates?

Yes, just like he would have to take off his rocketry badge, and his shoulder cord as these are not authorized for wear on a Sr member uniform.

[williamburdge]

That's what doesn't make sense to me, the Rocketry Program is specific to cadets, the NRA Marksmanship program is open to all ages, per the NRA's rules.  It makes sense that only cadets wear badges for cadet-only programs, but this isn't a cadet-only program.  This just looks like someone didn't pay attention when the NRA changed the program, and this regulation should have changed with the NRA.  Now we would be ordering qualified marksmen to remove awards and I can't see a valid reason why.

[Eclipse]

That's what doesn't make sense to me, the Rocketry Program is specific to cadets, the NRA Marksmanship program is open to all ages, per the NRA's rules.  It makes sense that only cadets wear badges for cadet-only programs, but this isn't a cadet-only program.  This just looks like someone didn't pay attention when the NRA changed the program, and this regulation should have changed with the NRA.  Now we would be ordering qualified marksmen to remove awards and I can't see a valid reason why.

Yes, the NRA program is open to anyone, but CAP considers firearms training a cadet-only activity.

[williamburdge]

Yes, the NRA program is open to anyone, but CAP considers firearms training a cadet-only activity.

Well, that's obviously a mistake in the regs, as the youth-only program doesn't exist and has been replaced by the current program.  If the regs are going to authorize the new medals they should be authorized for anyone who has earned them.

[Eclipse]

CAPR 52-16 authorizes firearms training for cadets.

Please cite any regulation that authorizes firearms training for senior members.

[williamburdge]

2nd Amendment US Constitution.  Senior members don't need regs to authorize their own participation in firearms training and that is NOT the question here.  The question here is why is an award that both cadets and senior members can earn only permitted on a cadet uniform?  This is not a question of authorization to participate in firearms training.

[Alaric]

That's what doesn't make sense to me, the Rocketry Program is specific to cadets, the NRA Marksmanship program is open to all ages, per the NRA's rules.  It makes sense that only cadets wear badges for cadet-only programs, but this isn't a cadet-only program.  This just looks like someone didn't pay attention when the NRA changed the program, and this regulation should have changed with the NRA.  Now we would be ordering qualified marksmen to remove awards and I can't see a valid reason why.

You don't have to agree, but you can always suggest a modification to 39-1 as outlined in the manual

[Eclipse]

2nd Amendment US Constitution.  Senior members don't need regs to authorize their own participation in firearms training and that is NOT the question here.  The question here is why is an award that both cadets and senior members can earn only permitted on a cadet uniform?  This is not a question of authorization to participate in firearms training.

You can do whatever you want on your own time.

CAP does not authorize senior members to participate in firearms training as members, nor do they recognize any awards you
may receive completing that training on your own time.

The 2nd amendment does not apply.

[MSG Mac]

39-1  specifically states that it is designed to  follow the Air Force Regs as closely as possible. Marksmanship badges are not worn on the USAF uniform, ergo not on the SM uniform.

[NIN]

Wait, did you just invoke the 2nd amendment as a reason for allowing marksmanship badges on the uniform? No. I'm sure I didn't read that right.

Because that would be like saying it's part of my 1st Amendment right to wear a pink tutu with my uniform. Free speech and all that. Freedom to exercise my religion. You know the one that requires me to wear a pink tutu.

[Shuman 14]

39-1  specifically states that it is designed to  follow the Air Force Regs as closely as possible. Marksmanship badges are not worn on the USAF uniform, ergo not on the SM uniform.

Actually, with the the new updated instruction which allows the wear of all other US Service badges on the USAF uniform, Marksmanship Qualification badges are authorized.

Just not NRA ones.

[JeffDG]

2nd Amendment US Constitution.

Not applicable to this situation, as CAP is a private, not governmental, organization.

The Constitution regulates (with the exception of the 13th Amendment and the 18th Amendment as modified by the 21st Amendment) relations between private parties and governments, or governments and governments.  It has no applicability to relations between private parties and other private parties.

[Storm Chaser]

The NRA program is not a CAP program and it's certainly not a senior member program. You can't wear the badge is if you're not a cadet. Period.

[lordmonar]

Sounds like a white paper with a suggestion to expand the badge wear is in the works

[Eclipse]

Sounds like a white paper with a suggestion to expand the bra badge wear is in the works

((*snicker*))

Your Freudian Slip is showing...

[lordmonar]

Sounds like a white paper with a suggestion to expand the bra badge wear is in the works

((*snicker*))

Your Freudian Slip is showing...

thanks fixed

[Storm Chaser]

Sounds like a white paper with a suggestion to expand the badge wear is in the works

Do we really need another badge?

[AlphaSigOU]

Sounds like a white paper with a suggestion to expand the badge wear is in the works

Do we really need another badge?

Badges? We don't need no steenkin' badges!!!

[abdsp51]

No we don't need another badge.  36-2903 authorizes sister service badges yes and I would have to look but I do not believe marksmanship badges are authorized.  The Excellence in Competition badge is authorized for wear.