Presidential Salute

[Flying Pig]

Here is a little trivia regarding the President returning salutes.  Contrary to popular belief, there is no saluting protocol for the President.  We discussed this in Boot Camp in one of our many sleepy classes.


From President Ronald Reagan

PRESIDENTIAL TRADITION
I never ceased to enjoy reviewing our men and women in uniform and hope I started a new tradition for presidents. As commander in chief, I discovered it was customary for our uniformed men and women to salute whenever they saw me. When I'd walk down the steps of a helicopter, for example, there was always a Marine waiting there to salute me. I was told presidents weren't supposed to return salutes, so I didn't, but this made me feel a little uncomfortable. Normally, a person offering a salute waits until it is returned, then brings down his hand. Sometimes, I realized, the soldier, sailor, marine, or airman giving me a salute wasn't sure when he was supposed to lower his hand. Initially, I nodded and smiled and said hello and thought maybe that would bring down the hand, but usually it didn't. Finally, one night when Nancy and I were attending a concert at the Marine Corps headquarters, I told the Commandant of Marines, "I know it's customary for the president to receive these salutes, but I was once an officer and realize that you're not supposed to salute when you're in civilian clothes. I think there ought to be a regulation that the president could return a salute inasmuch as he is commander in chief and civilian clothes are his uniform." "Well, if you did return a salute," the general said, "I don't think anyone would say anything to you about it."

The next time I got a salute, I saluted back. A big grin came over the Marine's face and down came his hand. From then on, I always returned salutes. When George Bush followed me into the White House, I encouraged him to keep up the tradition.

[Stonewall]

Funny you posted this.

During the parade on Tuesday, I watched as President Obama and VP Biden returned salutes throughout the day.

I'm not picky and I am not interested in a debate about military service and the presidency.  But I do think that a few more minutes on the exchange of salutes should have been addressed prior to this occasion.  I'm sure they were briefed, but their salutes need some work.  On one accasion, I saw VP Biden return a salute but instead of dropping it, he went to a little "too-da-loo" wave...reminding me of something Hawkeye on M*A*S*H would have done.

Seriously.  I am not bashing the C-in-C.  I appreciate their service, etc.  Sort of blaming this one on a military aide.

[Eclipse]

I noticed when W-ya got off Air Force 1 Executive 1 in Midland, he stopped at the end of the stairs and shook hands with the (still saluting) USAF officer standing guard.  I'm guessing as thank you for service, etc. 

Was nice to see it.

[Flying Pig]

Obama had a pretty sharp salute though.  He was just a little confused as when to whip it out.  Im sure with everything else that has been crammed down his throat it looked like someone at least took a moment to flatten out his hand and place his middle finger on the corner of his eye.  The media has already pointed out Bidens "signature salute"  As he drops it, he points at you.  A little corny. 

[JohnKachenmeister]

I remember when Reagan started that tradition.  It was so typical of him... just an ordinary guy who served his country then went back to his job in Hollywood after the war.

Bush 41 was once asked by Clinton what he should know and do as president, and George the First told him "Learn to salute."  Of course, he never quite got it right.

Incidentally, of all the Hollywood types who served in various duties during World War II, only ONE actually held a commission as an officer on Dec. 7, 1941.

That was, of course, Ronald Reagan, 1st Lieutenant of Cavalry, California National Guard.  Upon mobilization he was transferred to the Air Corps as a captain.

Only one Hollywood type was on active duty on Dec. 7, 1941.  Aviation Cadet James "Jimmy" Stewart, later Brigadier General, US Air Force Reserve.

[JoeTomasone]

Hey, if I can be saluted by a member of the military and return it, surely the C-in-C should be able to.

[dwb]

Hey, if I can be saluted by a member of the military and return it, surely the C-in-C should be able to.

Of course.  But Jan 20 was probably the first time Obama or Biden actually had to salute in a ceremony like that.  I'm sure you weren't an expert saluter on your first day, either.

I didn't see Biden's salute, but I thought Obama's was pretty sharp.

[Stonewall]

I didn't see Biden's salute, but I thought Obama's was pretty sharp.

Biden's isn't bad on the up-swing, it's the "follow through" that's an issue (sometimes).  He likes to do a little wave/point instead of bringing it down.  Kind of funny actually, not a real issue...maybe to some, but not me.

Better than this...

[dwb]

Or this one!

Clinton never really mastered the salute.  Reagan had a great one, even if it was a touch theatrical (like a lot of things he did).  Both Bushes had decent salutes, too.

[Flying Pig]

These are pretty good.  However, since Bush was a military officer it should have ben a no brainer.

[JoeTomasone]

Hey, if I can be saluted by a member of the military and return it, surely the C-in-C should be able to.

Of course.  But Jan 20 was probably the first time Obama or Biden actually had to salute in a ceremony like that.  I'm sure you weren't an expert saluter on your first day, either.

I didn't see Biden's salute, but I thought Obama's was pretty sharp.

I wasn't referring to style or competence in saluting, I was referring to the propriety of the President returning a salute - didn't quite make that clear, though. 

[dwb]

Sorry dude.  Message boards are no good for conveying tone of voice. 

[sardak]

Obama got his first lesson in saluting in a good natured exchange.  After Bush's departure from the east side of the Capitol, the new Prez and VP were joined on the steps by a general for the first review of the troops.  After the last of them went by, Obama turned to the general and stuck out his hand to shake hands.  The general immediately snapped a salute.  Obama cracked a smile, shook his head and saluted.  The two then had a brief exchange with the look on Obama's face saying "I've got a lot to learn."

Mike

[Smokey]

This is for all of those here on CPTALK who try to come up with every reason in the book not to render a salute......(referencing some prior topics) .....

Even though I think Obama is the biggest #%$$&^%$#*&^,  as my commander in chief I WILL render him a sharply executed salute should I have have the misfortune to meet him while he is C in C.

[MIKE]

^ Was that really necessary?  If as your CinC, you'd salute and execute... you'd think you would also keep your personal feelings to yourself as well.

[Flying Pig]

This is for all of those here on CPTALK who try to come up with every reason in the book not to render a salute......(referencing some prior topics) .....

Even though I think Obama is the biggest #%$$&^%$#*&^,  as my commander in chief I WILL render him a sharply executed salute should I have have the misfortune to meet him while he is C in C.

Dude

This was a discussion I started as some trivia about the history of the President saluting.  Nowhere in here has anyone started an argument about trying to get out of saluting.   I for one thought ALL Presidents throughout history saluted.  I had no idea Reagan started it.  I also didnt realize the President has no saluting protocol whatsoever.  They do it as they see fit.  So lets not make this a political angle.

There is some other trivia about this I am working on but waiting for the answers before I post.  That way I look like the smart one!  So lets not get this locked for President bashing.

[Smokey]

The idea was not meant to be political.  It was in reference to other threads where folks tried to come up with every reason imaginable as a reason not to salute.

My point was that although I have personal feelings...I still WOULD SMARTLY EXECUTE a salute.  Pointing out that a salute is proper.

That was to point out that we should ALL be rending those proper courtesies.

Apologies to those I offended , especially those who are fans of the C in C.

[dwb]

Even though I think Obama is the biggest #%$$&^%$#*&^,  as my commander in chief I WILL render him a sharply executed salute should I have the misfortune to meet him while he is C in C.

This reminds me of when I was the administrator of the CadetStuff forums, and people would say "with all due respect..." and then say something that was shockingly disrespectful.

The point of a courtesy (like the salute) is to be courteous.  It's not just for show, the underlying message is that you're supposed to be nice to people.

It used to be people referring to Bush as "shrub", now apparently it's people referring to Obama as the "biggest #%$$&^%$#*&^".  Disrespect cuts across party lines, apparently.

[flyguy06]

These are pretty good.  However, since Bush was a military officer it should have ben a no brainer.

he waas inthe Air Guard. trust me, being an Army Guard officer I cantell you that we dont get to practice saluting that often. You'd be surprised at how little Guardsmen salute one another. We try to focus more on doing our jobs than pomp and cercumstances.

[Flying Pig]

These are pretty good.  However, since Bush was a military officer it should have ben a no brainer.

he waas inthe Air Guard. trust me, being an Army Guard officer I cantell you that we dont get to practice saluting that often. You'd be surprised at how little Guardsmen salute one another. We try to focus more on doing our jobs than pomp and cercumstances.

Uhhhh..Yes he was in the Air Guard.  Interesting, especially coming from an Infantry Officer.  Ill let my officer buddies know to spend more time at work and less time playing parade.  (scratching head)

I guess the Infantry I grew up in is different than yours.

[Rotorhead]

My observation of Clinton was that, rather than "fake" a good salute, he often nodded when saluted.

Which, as CinC was his preogative.

[smj58501]

I didn't see Biden's salute, but I thought Obama's was pretty sharp.

Biden's isn't bad on the up-swing, it's the "follow through" that's an issue (sometimes).  He likes to do a little wave/point instead of bringing it down.  Kind of funny actually, not a real issue...maybe to some, but not me.

Better than this...

^^ I wonder how many martin's WJC had just polished off before this picture was taken

[flyguy06]

These are pretty good.  However, since Bush was a military officer it should have ben a no brainer.

he waas inthe Air Guard. trust me, being an Army Guard officer I cantell you that we dont get to practice saluting that often. You'd be surprised at how little Guardsmen salute one another. We try to focus more on doing our jobs than pomp and cercumstances.

Uhhhh..Yes he was in the Air Guard.  Interesting, especially coming from an Infantry Officer.  Ill let my officer buddies know to spend more time at work and less time playing parade.  (scratching head)

I guess the Infantry I grew up in is different than yours.

I guess so. because when I was at the company level, I rarely got saluted. Maybe if we were on a base.........um no cause whenever we were on post we were inthe field. Sorry. I would love to say I was saluted but i wasnt that much nor other officers in my company. i remember at Annual training and we were at the DFAC. Active duty guys saluted me all the time. NG soldiers, not so much. Of course this wasnt an Infantry unit. It is the current unit I am in.

[DG]

I watched the inuguration all day Tuesday.

I saw President Obama get saluted about 200-300 times.

Not once did I see him return the salute.

Rather, he acted like he did not see the salute or the military serviceman rendering the salute.

I assumed it is because he does not have a familiarity with the interaction or feel comfortable.   

In the election, it was not brought up much about his military service.  But it is showing now.

BTW, I am excited about the possibilities about what our new President can do for our country, and the difficult times we are facing.

[FlexCoder]

Obama did not salute any of the soldiers during Memorial Day & the fourth of July last year as well.    He was aware, just not a pro military type.  We all hope he does well too and does not change the Constitution.  However, the economy will get worse before it gets better unfortunately.   Nothing to be excited about yet.   Time will tell though.   

[BrianH76]

I found this picture of President Obama during the inaugural parade.  Pretty sharp, I thought.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/central-inauguration-parade-pg,1,6618532.photogallery

[Major Carrales]

Guys, lay off the politics.  There are umpteen forums were any one of us can go to "Bush bash," "McCain Defame" or "Obama hate."  Let this be one where we don't.

The last thing I intend to write on the matter is this...

Our new CinC is our President and we wish him well because "so goes an administration, so goes the nation."  Support the good governance of our nation.  Stop being Republicans and Democrats, conservatives and liberals and "red vs Blue;" stop the "gang warfare." 

T'was written best by President Washington in his farewell...
"The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge, natural to party dissension, which in different ages and countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism." 

Thus we see it here...the hatred of a man for pure political reasons.  Smart man that Washington, we ought best start listening.  We can all salute him best by reexamining our mantles of political discourse.

[Flying Pig]

I think we have behaved pretty well.  There really hasnt been any "bashing"  except for one post.

[DG]

I found this picture of President Obama during the inaugural parade.  Pretty sharp, I thought.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/central-inauguration-parade-pg,1,6618532.photogallery

Saluting the flag.

So he sulutes the flag, even if he does not return a salute.

[Major Carrales]

I think we have behaved pretty well.  There really hasnt been any "bashing"  except for one post.

I am well aware, there was only on incident on this thread that walked the line; however, what I said needs to be said as often as it can. 

[RogueLeader]

I am well aware, there was only on incident on this thread that walked the line; however, what I said needs to be said as often as it can. 

So it is ok that he salutes the colors, but not retuning the ones that defend the colors?  I do not thaink that the statement was out of line.  Pres. Obamas' actions have brought a valid question.

It is my belief that you are implying DG was wrong by making a stament about Pres. Obamas conduct.

[PHall]

I found this picture of President Obama during the inaugural parade.  Pretty sharp, I thought.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/central-inauguration-parade-pg,1,6618532.photogallery

Saluting the flag.

So he sulutes the flag, even if he does not return a salute.

Well, like it was stated earlier in this thread, he's not required to return salutes. It's only a tradition that was started by President Reagan.

President Obama has pretty much zero experience with the military, which is pretty much the norm for his generation.

But, I'm sure if a well written, polite inquiry sent to the President on why he doesn't return salutes would get some kind of reply.

And maybe some returned salutes in the future.

[DG]

Just stating the facts.

Observations, not opinions.

[DG]

I thought his reference to one post was to the guy who said in an immediaetly prior post that:

"^^ I wonder how many martin's WJC had just polished off before this picture was taken"

[Rotorhead]

Obama did not salute any of the soldiers during Memorial Day & the fourth of July last year as well.    He was aware, just not a pro military type.  We all hope he does well too and does not change the Constitution. 

The President cannot "change the Constitution."

[Major Carrales]

I am well aware, there was only one incident on this thread that walked the line; however, what I said needs to be said as often as it can. 

So it is ok that he salutes the colors, but not retuning the ones that defend the colors?  I do not thaink that the statement was out of line.  Pres. Obamas' actions have brought a valid question.

It is my belief that you are implying DG was wrong by making a stament about Pres. Obamas conduct.

The One I am refering to is...

Even though I think Obama is the biggest #%$$&^%$#*&^

I am saddened that some of you are not able to rise above petty political jabs and just have to "go there."  Obama was not my candidate, however, I believe in being fair and objective.  He was not President a week before people have already started trying to make mountians out of molehills.

Well, be the prevailing view what they may but I am going to give President Obama the courtesy, fair shake and benefit of the doubt that Presidents Clinton and Bush did not get.

I would suggest you people let the new President's adminsitration omplete the first 100 days before saying... "The President doesn't salute" this or that.

C'mon folks, a degree of civilty would be nice.

[Gunner C]

Obama did not salute any of the soldiers during Memorial Day & the fourth of July last year as well. 

He wasn't the commander-in-chief at the time.  Senators don't salute (unless they're retired or reserve military officers)

[JayT]

I am well aware, there was only on incident on this thread that walked the line; however, what I said needs to be said as often as it can. 

So it is ok that he salutes the colors, but not retuning the ones that defend the colors?  I do not thaink that the statement was out of line.  Pres. Obamas' actions have brought a valid question.

It is my belief that you are implying DG was wrong by making a stament about Pres. Obamas conduct.

Is that really a 'valid question' less then a week into his presidency?

Not the crumbling econonmy, the enviroment thats collasping from under our feet, the multiple military engagements  we're committed to, the lack of proper equipment to our troops, residual racism in America, poverty, abortion rights, stem cell research, a low caliber education system, increasing college tution, a collapse of the social contract system, people losing their homes, etc etc?

No, let's worry about him saluting.

Let's get real gentlemen.

[flyguy06]

 :clap: Couldnt have said it better myself

[DG]

[The One I am refering to is...

Even though I think Obama is the biggest #%$$&^%$#*&^

I agree completely.

Inapppropriate post for this forum.

[Ricochet13]

I watched the inuguration all day Tuesday.
I saw President Obama get saluted about 200-300 times.
Not once did I see him return the salute.
Rather, he acted like he did not see the salute or the military serviceman rendering the salute.
I assumed it is because he does not have a familiarity with the interaction or feel comfortable.   
In the election, it was not brought up much about his military service.  But it is showing now.
BTW, I am excited about the possibilities about what our new President can do for our country, and the difficult times we are facing.

I found this picture of President Obama during the inaugural parade.  Pretty sharp, I thought.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/central-inauguration-parade-pg,1,6618532.photogallery

Actually I did see the President place his hand over his heart as various colors passed by the Inaugural parade.   I even seem to recall him saluting once or twice as it struck me that is was a decent salute in terms of what D & C might expect.

[Smokey]

Most of you missed the point of my post...

The point was not meant to be political...................bear with me...

In previous threads here, some folks were coming up with all sorts of reasons NOT to render a salute.  Some of those reason bordered on bizarre.

My point was directed to those folks who try to avoid salutes in any way possible.   Although I do not care for Obama, as CinC, I said I would smartly execute a salute as that is the proper thing to do.  See the point is, no matter my personal feelings (the point , not necessarily political) is that I would render a salute.  Customs and courtesies are not decided by feelings.  Some things are just the right thing to do.

Many of you are reading toooooooo much into my statement.  I made it especially bold to argue the point.  I guess it was too far above the heads of some of you.  For that I apologize.

[JayT]

Most of you missed the point of my post...

The point was not meant to be political...................bear with me...

In previous threads here, some folks were coming up with all sorts of reasons NOT to render a salute.  Some of those reason bordered on bizarre.

My point was directed to those folks who try to avoid salutes in any way possible.   Although I do not care for Obama, as CinC, I said I would smartly execute a salute as that is the proper thing to do.  See the point is, no matter my personal feelings (the point , not necessarily political) is that I would render a salute.  Customs and courtesies are not decided by feelings.  Some things are just the right thing to do.

Many of you are reading toooooooo much into my statement.  I made it especially bold to argue the point.  I guess it was too far above the heads of some of you.  For that I apologize.

Excuse me, don't disrespect myself and the other guys on this board because you referring to the elected President of the United States as a "**$%*$%$" 'went over our heads.'

It's not difficult to read to much into such a simpleton statement I suppose.

[Maj Ballard]

I think the point is also that we don't need to know that you "do not care for Obama." It's irrelevant and has no bearing on this or any other discussion in this forum.

Most of you missed the point of my post...

The point was not meant to be political...................bear with me...

In previous threads here, some folks were coming up with all sorts of reasons NOT to render a salute.  Some of those reason bordered on bizarre.

My point was directed to those folks who try to avoid salutes in any way possible.   Although I do not care for Obama, as CinC, I said I would smartly execute a salute as that is the proper thing to do.  See the point is, no matter my personal feelings (the point , not necessarily political) is that I would render a salute.  Customs and courtesies are not decided by feelings.  Some things are just the right thing to do.

Many of you are reading toooooooo much into my statement.  I made it especially bold to argue the point.  I guess it was too far above the heads of some of you.  For that I apologize.

[Rotorhead]

I guess it was too far above the heads of some of you.  For that I apologize.

Nope, I saw clearly that you managed to insert into both posts the fact that you disapprove of Obama.

That part was not needed to convey your on-topic point.

[MIKE]

This one is done.