Training

[rebowman]

What if a commander wants everyone in the squadron trained to be on a ground team - at least to the minumum of trainee status?

My concern is that he wants everyone - including those personnel who are not interested in ground team.  Some simply are not interested.  And, there are some who wouldn't be able to do the "legwork" and "gruntwork" associated with ground team - either due to laziness or health reasons. 

He wants everyone to be taught survival - but, isn't survival better to be taught in the field vs. in the classroom?  Most of our members would have to be dragged to the field.

[D2SK]

Maybe you should address your concerns with your commander instead of a public message forum.

[Stonewall]

ES is a part of CAP, just like CP and AE.

I was never very interested in Aerospace Education as a cadet or senior member, but I still attended meetings on AE nights, built a model rocket, went to air shows and earned the Yeager Award. 

CAP, especially for cadets, is a "whole package" type deal.  No one should really pick and choose their level of participation based solely on the subject matter of a particular activity or meeting night.  You never know, you may find yourself interested in ES stuff.

At my squadron we had everyone get qualified in General Emergency Services and then began working on UDF.  It didn't require any true "field work" and it could be done during the ES night of the regular meeting.  Did everyone end up with a UDF 101 card?  Nope.  But it was an activity that was interesting, involved all members and perhaps sparked an interest in ES with several members who otherwise weren't interested.

[Duke Dillio]

I would simply consider the topics that are included in the prep stuff for GTM-3 as good life lessons.  Field sanitation and hygiene, treating hot and cold weather injuries, using a compass, conducting a phone alert, and exercising universal precautions are all basic skills that I would probably teach to everyone, regardless of whether or not they are interested in becoming a ground team member.  Also, consider that if there are air crew members in your squadron, these are all good skills to have.  Each of the skills is fairly universal.  About half of the tasks that are presented in the Fam/prep section of the SQTR are basic first aid skills.  The only things really specific to the ground team would be the tasks associated with ground team equipment however I wouldn't be heartbroken to see aircrew or mission base people having all of this equipment with them at missions.  Phone alerts are important in times of crisis so that is also a good thing to understand.

For those who aren't interested in ES, do they do the AE stuff too?  I have always found that a balanced unit is a better unit than one that specializes in just one aspect of the program.  Granted, most senior squadrons are that way and I am not knocking them.  I just think that overall, a wide array of experiences makes for a better program.

[MIKE]

CAP, especially for cadets, is a "whole package" type deal.  No one should really pick and choose their level of participation based solely on the subject matter of a particular activity or meeting night.  You never know, you may find yourself interested in ES stuff.

Disagree, since ES is not part and parcel of the Cadet Program like AE is... Emergency Services is ancillary.

Forcing an ancillary program on cadets or even pogue seniors is just wasting everybody's time and resources.

[lordmonar]

CAP, especially for cadets, is a "whole package" type deal.  No one should really pick and choose their level of participation based solely on the subject matter of a particular activity or meeting night.  You never know, you may find yourself interested in ES stuff.

Disagree, since ES is not part and parcel of the Cadet Program like AE is... Emergency Services is ancillary.

Forcing an ancillary program on cadets or even pogue seniors is just wasting everybody's time and resources.

You are assuming that this individual is in a cadet squadron........then your statement would be 90% correct....but if he is in a composite squadron then ES is not ancillary....but critical to the squadron's mission.

[lordmonar]

What if a commander wants everyone in the squadron trained to be on a ground team - at least to the minumum of trainee status?

My concern is that he wants everyone - including those personnel who are not interested in ground team.  Some simply are not interested.  And, there are some who wouldn't be able to do the "legwork" and "gruntwork" associated with ground team - either due to laziness or health reasons. 

He wants everyone to be taught survival - but, isn't survival better to be taught in the field vs. in the classroom?  Most of our members would have to be dragged to the field.

It is completely with the perview of the commander to require everyone to become GT qualified.  If a member is unable to complete the training due to health concerns then that person can't/shouldn't be required to do so.

But everyone else......they should comply with your commander's wishes/orders.

[MIKE]

... Or vote with your feet.

[arajca]

Which is why I didn't join the first squadron I checked out. I had no interest in becoming aircrew qualified - still don't. And they wouldn't even talk to you abuot what YOU were interested in until you were aircrew qualified - using their program of 10 Saturday meetings (every week).

[EMT-83]

I'm thinking that the commander has more in mind than just getting everyone GT trained. How many of those members not interested in ES actually have something to do on meeting nights? We all hear about members who drop out because they're bored.

This sounds like a great opportunity to get folks involved with an aspect of CAP that's unfamiliar to them, develop a squadron skills baseline, generate some unit cohesiveness, and maybe even pick up a few members who find that they really like "gruntwork" once they've been exposed to it.

[RiverAux]

It is completely with the perview of the commander to require everyone to become GT qualified.

Actually no.  The only power the commander has in this regard is to refuse to sign off on a members request to train or to become qualified in a specialty.  A commander can't tell you to train for something you don't want to. 

Now, the commander can decide to teach nothing but ground team classes in which case the member has the choice to attend and participate or not, but even then the member has the right to come to the meetings but not do anything beyond that to become qualified. 

[lordmonar]

RiverAux....I respectfully disagree.

A commander most certainly can say you must train for a certain function.....if you refuse he can determine that he does not need you and 2b you.

Not saying any commander should do this....but he can.

Membership in CAP is not a right.

[RiverAux]

I think such a 2b would be laughed out of the MARB within about 5 seconds.  Under your theory my squadron commander could order me to train to become a mission pilot and then kick me out for not going to flight school to get my certificate so that I can fly the plane.  No difference between that and kicking someone out for not taking a basic first aid class required for the GT program.   

[lordmonar]

If your commander needed pilots....he could decide that he no longer needed any non-pilots and eliminate anyone who did contribute to "his" mission.

Like I said....I don't think he should ever do something like that...but he certainly could.

As far as doing a 2b....I don't think that would ever happen....but you could be transfered to the 000 squadron.

As for requiring training....what would you do to someone who refused to complete level 1 training?

[LtCol057]

If someone refused to complete the Level 1 training, I'd have a heart to heart with them and ask them why they were there.  Without Level 1, they can't do a thing in CAP except sit there.  They can't be assigned a staff position, they can't be promoted, without the CPPT they can't be around the cadets. Then I'd submit a 2a and change their membership to patron and thank them for their money.