Service Dress Jacket (Old Style vs. New Style)

[USNASomeDay]

Some brief questions about the SDU jacket:
        - Which is more preferred; "old" style (4-button) or new style (3-button)?
        - Is there a difference between the officer and enlisted old style jacket? (I'm not sure, but I know there is on the new style)

I went ahead and bought the old style jacket back in March. Should I just buy the new style jacket, or would it be okay to wear the old style at official CAP functions (39-1 states that the old style is optional). Also, my jacket came with epaulets. Would this be inappropriate (considering my rank), or do all the old style jackets come with them already attached?

I don't know if this has been preciously discussed (I went back a couple of pages, and didn't see anything really concerning the old style service dress).

[Krapenhoeffer]

Are you a Cadet? If yes, then wear the old style.

All the old style jackets had epaulets, and that was one of the big stinks that came with the new style.

If you are not a cadet, you need to wear the new style, with epaulets.

[Hawk200]

Cadets may wear the old style indefinitely.

Cadets may wear the new style with or without epaulets.

Seniors are only authorized the new style. If you're an officer, you need the one with epaulets. NCOs may wear the one without epaulets since Air Force enlisted don't wear epaulets.

[vmstan]

If you wear the old style jacket, make sure the pants are of matching color shade.

[jimmydeanno]

Some brief questions about the SDU jacket:
        - Which is more preferred; "old" style (4-button) or new style (3-button)?
        - Is there a difference between the officer and enlisted old style jacket? (I'm not sure, but I know there is on the new style)

The material is different between the 4 and 3 button.  The 3 button is the new/current service coat and will actually match the pants that came to you in the mail.  For cadets, there isn't a preference, but I would assume that any old style bought nowadays would be pretty faded and dated looking.

I went ahead and bought the old style jacket back in March. Should I just buy the new style jacket, or would it be okay to wear the old style at official CAP functions (39-1 states that the old style is optional). Also, my jacket came with epaulets. Would this be inappropriate (considering my rank), or do all the old style jackets come with them already attached?

There is no problem with having epaulets.

Now, for my personal opinion.  I think it is time for the old coats to go.  We're at about the 15 year mark now (I think), the pant material is different now, and the style of the coat doesn't match anything anymore.  However, you're allowed to wear it and I'm not going to suggest that you go spend the money on a new one.

[MIKE]

What is the shade number on your trousers?  While cadets are authorized the old style, the coat and trousers must match per CAPM 39-1 2-1. a.

[USNASomeDay]

What is the shade number on your trousers?  While cadets are authorized the old style, the coat and trousers must match per CAPM 39-1 2-1. a.

I'm not sure, but I think the shade on the old style is 1620, whereas the shade on the issue dress blue pants is 1580 (just going from memory). Which isn't too much of a difference from 10' feet or so.

My jacket is actually in pretty good condition (not faded or "old looking"). However, I do agree that, per 39-1, the color should match between the pants and jacket.

[USNASomeDay]

By the way, what would be the best place to buy a new SDU jacket? (the one I currently have was purchased from an online surplus store for $20) I personally like the look of the old style vs. the new, but for uniformity issues I think I should buy the new style as well.

[MIKE]

I'm not sure, but I think the shade on the old style is 1620, whereas the shade on the issue dress blue pants is 1580 (just going from memory). Which isn't too much of a difference from 10' feet or so.

I'd say those are flipped since a new style jacket is shade 1620.

By the way, what would be the best place to buy a new SDU jacket? (the one I currently have was purchased from an online surplus store for $20) I personally like the look of the old style vs. the new, but for uniformity issues I think I should buy the new style as well.

AAFES MCSS for a new one, base thrift shop/Airman's Attic or ebay.  I got mine for $25 used at the Hansom AFB. Thrift Shop, also some $4 trousers and a $15 overcoat.

[USNASomeDay]

I'm not sure, but I think the shade on the old style is 1620, whereas the shade on the issue dress blue pants is 1580 (just going from memory). Which isn't too much of a difference from 10' feet or so.

I'd say those are flipped since a new style jacket is shade 1620.

Yeah, I think I may have transposed the shades   

[Pylon]

For what it's worth, I personally like uniformity and so our squadron issued new-style jackets to pretty much all of our cadets free of charge (with the exception of a few cadets for whom I couldn't get the correct size).  Of course they have to/had to return them if/when they leave.  The old-style ones we had in supply, we gave to other units.   So when our cadets wear service dress, they all look uniform and also match the senior members (and any AF personnel if around). 

It took some effort to get service dress for pretty much everyone, but the new-style enlisted jackets are pretty common and fairly cheap.  It's do-able.  But just my personal opinion.  I understand there's always the cost factor for cadets.

[CAP277]

Save your money and just use the old-style if thats what you already have. I've been rocking the old-style my entire cadet career (worth the $20 investment it was)

[AlphaSigOU]

Some of the shades encountered on the service dress uniform:

OLD STYLE

Shade 84/1084 - Bluish gray shade wool/poly wool, 'Captain Kangaroo' lower pockets.
Shade 1549 - More blue, removes the lower pockets but keeps the pocket flaps.
Shade 1577 - Doubleknit polyester, same style as 1549.
Shade 1603 - IIRC, current issue at the Air Force Academy.

NEW STYLE

Shade 1620 - Current issue poly wool.
Shade 1625 - Doubleknit polyester. Only the trousers are sold today; at one time a doubleknit service dress jacket was available.

[Shawn W.]

I think it's time to ditch the old Service Jacket as well. As a supply officer, it's a logistical nightmare for me to get my hands on the older style pants that match the old Service Jacket. But that's just my opinion.

[Abby.L]

I think it's time to ditch the old Service Jacket as well. As a supply officer, it's a logistical nightmare for me to get my hands on the older style pants that match the old Service Jacket. But that's just my opinion.

I think that the costs of ditching the old style would far outweigh the benefits. As a lower class citizen, it would pain me far more to buy a new style jacket than to go to the local thrift store and find an old-style for cheap. Sure, you can find the occasional new style(Enlisted or officer, with the former more common) at a thrift shop, but that only occurs once in a blue moon. I know that CAP means 'Come And Pay' (Or any variation with the same meaning), but I shouldn't have to pay more than I have to in order to do what I love. I can understand any wish to be in regs with the 'matching shade' thing, but really, how obvious can it really be? At 10 feet, I really wouldn't even notice if the shades were different. 5, even. I mean, I just have some blues pants of unknown shades, and I have my service coat. That's really all it is.
[\Poor person rant]

[SarDragon]

The shade difference is very noticeable, especially when they are freshly cleaned.

[Duke Dillio]

^^^  +46

The new style is much darker than the old style.  Also, the old style tends to have been washed quite a bit more and so is generally faded quite a bit.  It is easy to spot the old versus the new and when you mix the two, it looks absolutely wretched...

[Майор Хаткевич]

I think that the costs of ditching the old style would far outweigh the benefits.

There would only be a minimal sunk cost, affecting maybe less than 15% of the members.

As a lower class citizen, it would pain me far more to buy a new style jacket

You do not need, nor are required to have one.

but I shouldn't have to pay more than I have to in order to do what I love.

You don't have to.

I can understand any wish to be in regs with the 'matching shade' thing, but really, how obvious can it really be?

Very. At quite a distance.

[flyboy53]

Some brief questions about the SDU jacket:
        - Which is more preferred; "old" style (4-button) or new style (3-button)?
        - Is there a difference between the officer and enlisted old style jacket? (I'm not sure, but I know there is on the new style)

I went ahead and bought the old style jacket back in March. Should I just buy the new style jacket, or would it be okay to wear the old style at official CAP functions (39-1 states that the old style is optional). Also, my jacket came with epaulets. Would this be inappropriate (considering my rank), or do all the old style jackets come with them already attached?

I don't know if this has been preciously discussed (I went back a couple of pages, and didn't see anything really concerning the old style service dress).

Cadets can continue wearing the old uniform.

At this stage of the game, I would tell you to continue wearing the old style jacket if you have everything else to match it, but that may be more of a hassle than it's worth. Matching means, the flight or garison hat and pants must be of the same material, and the tie is different than the current one. If it doesn't match, it would be worthwhile to invest in the new uniform. I would keep a sharp eye on the racks of Salvation Army, Goodwill, or similar stores.

As for the old four button service coat, there were three versions during my career: a winter weight that was almost a gabardine and thick, a tropical or summer weight version that I wore most of the time and the double knits, which were the last ones I wore during my career. As sharp as the double knits looked, they snagged easily and that was a real pain.

Personnally, I still like the old four-button uniform. I always thought it was more military-looking, but we are in a new era of the Air Force and and you learn to embrace change.

[SarDragon]

Some brief questions about the SDU jacket:
        - Which is more preferred; "old" style (4-button) or new style (3-button)?
        - Is there a difference between the officer and enlisted old style jacket? (I'm not sure, but I know there is on the new style)

I went ahead and bought the old style jacket back in March. Should I just buy the new style jacket, or would it be okay to wear the old style at official CAP functions (39-1 states that the old style is optional). Also, my jacket came with epaulets. Would this be inappropriate (considering my rank), or do all the old style jackets come with them already attached?

I don't know if this has been preciously discussed (I went back a couple of pages, and didn't see anything really concerning the old style service dress).

Cadets can continue wearing the old uniform.

At this stage of the game, I would tell you to continue wearing the old style jacket if you have everything else to match it, but that may be more of a hassle than it's worth. Matching means, the flight or garison hat and pants must be of the same material, and the tie is different than the current one. If it doesn't match, it would be worthwhile to invest in the new uniform. I would keep a sharp eye on the racks of Salvation Army, Goodwill, or similar stores.

As for the old four button service coat, there were three versions during my career: a winter weight that was almost a gabardine and thick, a tropical or summer weight version that I wore most of the time and the double knits, which were the last ones I wore during my career. As sharp as the double knits looked, they snagged easily and that was a real pain.

Personnally, I still like the old four-button uniform. I always thought it was more military-looking, but we are in a new era of the Air Force and and you learn to embrace change.

Only the coat and trousers/skirt need to match.

The old-style Air Force service uniform for cadets will not be covered by this phase out rule and will continue to be authorized indefinitely. When old and new items are worn, the coat and slacks/skirt/trousers will be of a matching material (same shade, weave, and weight).

Flight cap - All shades and materials of cap are authorized with any uniform combination.