Proposed Communications Training Curriculum

Started by CAP.is.1337, April 11, 2008, 07:28:24 AM

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arajca

Quote from: NavLT on July 20, 2010, 01:21:43 PM
The ICut program looks ok on the surface.  I liked the idea of a multi tiered approach to the skill set BCut to use a radio, ACut to have a radio station.  The problem I have seen is that Comm is working on things in blocks and the coordination is not there.  The Specialty Track, ES qual, ICut/Acut/Bcut training and the physical assets need to be worked into a concurrent plan.
The wing level and below have said this for a couple years - since the plan was released. Heck, I was working on a unit comm officers course using the new curriculum, until I was told that I couldn't get any info from the folks who developed the curriculum, since they were planning to do it themselves at the end of ther process.

QuoteWe have people that want to do Comm specialty track training but are held up by the "communications meetings and communications exercises" which happen how often???.  We have people that want Comm Training for ES but find the SAR missions lack planning to flex comm skills (most recently op orders from wing have stated all teams must have a cell phone since comms are less than reliable).  We have people that want to train in Comm for the sake of professional growth but with the NTIA narrow band our wing asset list is now 1/10th what it was, wing no longer puts out anything over comm nets and field teams are being handed ISR radios with no range or repeater or Air to Ground for field work.
Comm meetings should be held at least annually. COWG holds theirs at the wing conference - not ideal, but it works. In many areas, OPS doesn't want anything to do with Comm except to get radios that we do not have to give to members who are not authorized a radio. I dealt with this for the past couple years, although COWG's new DO may be different - he's opened the discussion with me. Comm does not generate messages to put out over the nets, Command does. If Command doesn't give us anything to put out, nothing gets put out. As far as the assets go, get in line. Every wing DC has been complaining that there is not nearly enough equipment available to meet our needs.

QuoteAnd last but not least is the "Closed" comm mentality where they avoided pager, cell phone, email and web page communications until they created IT to handle them and now they have largely been left in the corner playing with their radios by themselves.  Unfortunately we still plan on leaning on them when the bomb drops and modern comm don't workbut now they done'play much with the real missions and ICs.

V/R
LT J
We've avoided that stuff because the members jump to the conclusion that if we plan for pagers, cell phones, etc, CAP will have to provide it and pay for it. As for not working with real missions, the paradym used by comm for planning and operations has been changed by the AF. Instead of the typical two-three resource incident, comm has to plan - and equipment is distributed to meet - the large scale, the-doo-doo-hit-the-fan incident. Again, the wing DCs have been complaining about this, with no result. Also, the various inspections Comm is subject to all require equipment to be distributed IAW the Table of Allowances. We do not have the option of doing otherwise, or else we get a finding. 

NavLT

Don't take my comments as criticism of a particlar point it is the barrage of symptoms that need addressing.  The once a year comm meeting and the fact that lots of people have the same complaint about training and equipment are proof positive of the issues.  The real problem is that command has not laid out the plan to the troops on how to deal with the issues.

I the peloponnesian war a shipment of food was on the way to a starving army, which revolted because they were hungry and did not know it was on the way.  The commander was being burned in a fire as the wagons arrived with the food.
It was the lack of a communicated plan on the food that lead to the commander being dinner not the actual lack of inbound food........

I hope that CAP commanders from units, groups, wings, regions and national take a hard look at all of the requirments to meet the training and operational needs of their people so we can provide the service our nation deserves. 

V/R
LT J

lordmonar

This is one of those horse and cart issues.

Unit commanders do not run the wing comm program.....that would be wing.  ;D

Unit commanders provide training to their people to support the wings operational requirements.....not the needs of the people.

(yes we should take into account their needs and wants...this is a volunteer organisation).

Ops drives manning and training requirments.

A commander's job is to train, man and equip his squadron to meet their mission requirments.

If there is no mission requirment (i.e. Wing not conducting Comm Exercises and Net Checks) then there is no need for squadron commanders to train their people to do it.

CAP comm has been one of my pet peeves from day one.

When they finally get the ICUT program running then maybe we can move on and correct a lot of the problems I see in the CAP Comm program.
PATRICK M. HARRIS, SMSgt, CAP

Capt Rivera

//Signed//

Joshua Rivera, Capt, CAP
Squadron Commander
Grand Forks Composite Squadron
North Dakota Wing, Civil Air Patrol
http://www.grandforkscap.org

SarDragon

According to the NHQ level folks, maybe next year. Or maybe not.

The repeater replacement effort had a much higher priority, and now that it has been completed, the new training program gets the nod.
Dave Bowles
Maj, CAP
AT1, USN Retired
50 Year Member
Mitchell Award (unnumbered)
C/WO, CAP, Ret

Capt Rivera

We are just waiting on videos right? How necessary are they? Could we start today and implement videos as we go along? Its not like the current B-CUT does what it needs to do... and it lacks video also ;)

Or are they still trying to replace blackboard?  If they have replaced it, does anyone know what they replaced it with?   

If Moodle is good (and it is) for the fortune 100 company I work for... why not CAP?
//Signed//

Joshua Rivera, Capt, CAP
Squadron Commander
Grand Forks Composite Squadron
North Dakota Wing, Civil Air Patrol
http://www.grandforkscap.org

Thom

Quote from: Capt Rivera on August 06, 2010, 04:16:09 PM
We are just waiting on videos right? How necessary are they? Could we start today and implement videos as we go along? Its not like the current B-CUT does what it needs to do... and it lacks video also ;)

Or are they still trying to replace blackboard?  If they have replaced it, does anyone know what they replaced it with?   

If Moodle is good (and it is) for the fortune 100 company I work for... why not CAP?

The issue is being addressed as part of a larger (much larger  :-\ ) project.  Yes, Blackboard is being replaced (for new efforts), and yes Moodle is the chosen platform to replace it.

None of this happens overnight, but there are a bunch of dedicated CAP folks working the task and we hope to have something to show in the not too terribly distant future.

Sorry for the delays.


Thom

Capt Rivera

//Signed//

Joshua Rivera, Capt, CAP
Squadron Commander
Grand Forks Composite Squadron
North Dakota Wing, Civil Air Patrol
http://www.grandforkscap.org

Spaceman3750

Didn't we just implement Blackboard? Why the sudden shift. Yes, it's a pain to use sometimes, but from what I hear it takes ~10 clicks in Moodle for every 1 in BB.

Capt Rivera

In a word... Money...

At least that's what I suspect... which is why I question BB from the start... we should have went the path of moodle/etc from the start...

For those who don't moodle... go learn bout it:  http://moodle.org/
//Signed//

Joshua Rivera, Capt, CAP
Squadron Commander
Grand Forks Composite Squadron
North Dakota Wing, Civil Air Patrol
http://www.grandforkscap.org

JC004

Quote from: Spaceman3750 on August 06, 2010, 06:49:17 PM
Didn't we just implement Blackboard? Why the sudden shift. Yes, it's a pain to use sometimes, but from what I hear it takes ~10 clicks in Moodle for every 1 in BB.

As someone who has been administering and customizing Moodle implementations for years (including for CAP), I don't think that I'd say that.  Moodle can use some user interface improvements, but so can Blackboard.  I've done these modifications myself and I thought that they made Moodle many times easier than BB.  Out of the box, it isn't THAT complex though.

Eclipse

Here's what we need.

1) This is a radio. (show radio)

2) This is the on switch.  (demonstrate)

3) This is the channel selector (it is set correctly now, never use it)

4) Press this button and speak.  Your voice will magically come out all over the place, both near and far.  Say "over" when you are done speaking. (No, you do not need to know how it works.  Wiki "radio" when you get home.)

6) Release (let go) button and LISTEN until the magic voice says "over".

7) Press button and respond. Say "over" when you are done speaking.

8) Repeat as necessary.

9) Say "out" when you feel the conversation is complete (only if you initiated (started) the conversation).

Appendix A:  Don't swear.  Speak clearly and slowly.  Only use the radio for CAP business.
Appendix B:  Radios are not a badge of honor or a ticket to the cool kids club.  They are a tool for a specific purpose.
Appendic C:  In 80-90% of the cases, your cell phone is a viable alternative and will work better.

You have all just completed Online Basic Radio user training.

We need big-button devices with clear instructions.  The majority of operators do not care or need to know about radio theory, design, or the physics of radios waves, propagation, or atmospheric skip.

Just show us how to use the equipment and leave everything else for those interested in being more than operators.




"That Others May Zoom"

Gung Ho

Quote from: Eclipse on August 07, 2010, 05:21:34 PM
Here's what we need.


Just show us how to use the equipment and leave everything else for those interested in being more than operators.

Need to have the equipment first, then we can worry about how to use it

arajca

#53
Quote from: Eclipse on August 07, 2010, 05:21:34 PM
Here's what we need.

1) This is a radio. (show radio)

2) This is the on switch.  (demonstrate)

3) This is the channel selector (it is set correctly now, never use it)

4) Press this button and speak.  Your voice will magically come out all over the place, both near and far.  Say "over" when you are done speaking. (No, you do not need to know how it works.  Wiki "radio" when you get home.)

6) Release (let go) button and LISTEN until the magic voice says "over".

7) Press button and respond. Say "over" when you are done speaking.

8) Repeat as necessary.

9) Say "out" when you feel the conversation is complete (only if you initiated (started) the conversation).

Appendix A:  Don't swear.  Speak clearly and slowly.  Only use the radio for CAP business.
Appendix B:  Radios are not a badge of honor or a ticket to the cool kids club.  They are a tool for a specific purpose.
Appendic C:  In 80-90% of the cases, your cell phone is a viable alternative and will work better.

You have all just completed Online Basic Radio user training.

We need big-button devices with clear instructions.  The majority of operators do not care or need to know about radio theory, design, or the physics of radios waves, propagation, or atmospheric skip.

Just show us how to use the equipment and leave everything else for those interested in being more than operators.
You forgot basic troubleshooting:
1. Radio has three parts - power, transceiver, antenna. If anyone of these are missing, the radio don't work. Make sure you have all three.

2. If the light doesn't come on when you talk, turn the radio on.

3. If the light comes on when you talk, but you can't here anyone, turn the volume up.
3a. If you changed the channel Gibbs-smack yourself and change it back.

Covers 99% of the problems with radios. Including pilots.

JC004

Quote from: arajca on August 08, 2010, 12:45:15 AM
You forgot basic troubleshooting:
1. Radio has three parts - power, transceiver, antenna. If anyone of these are missing, the radio don't work. Make sure you have all three.

2. If the light doesn't come on when you talk, turn the radio on.

3. If the light comes on when you talk, but you can't here anyone, turn the volume up.
3a. If you changed the channel Gibbs-smack yourself and change it back.

Covers 99% of the problems with radios. Including pilots.

I remember flying on a little Mission Scanner training thing.  I was in the back, doing my scanner-type things and the pilot wanted me to communicate with mission base.  We could never raise them the whole time.  I asked - he insisted the radio was working and all.  Turns out that it wasn't on.  So, yeaaaaaah...  I guess the pilot could have used your training above... *sigh*

RADIOMAN015

Comments below

Quote from: Eclipse on August 07, 2010, 05:21:34 PM

3) This is the channel selector (it is set correctly now, never use it)
Since there's a lack of radios, generally the radio (EF Johnson's) have to be placed in the scan mode (to monitor local fixed repeater & designated air/ground channel), and this is VERY challenging for most to answer the radio on another channel. 
4) Press this button and speak.  Your voice will magically come out all over the place, both near and far.  Say "over" when you are done speaking. (No, you do not need to know how it works.  Wiki "radio" when you get home.)
Disagree on this one --- In our wing ask the "brains" (likely a NESA graduate :-[ ) on one ground team that used the VHF antenna for the LPer and than forgot to plug the EF Johnson mobile back into the antenna.  The aircraft was flying overhead and could just about hear the radio.  Fortunately the radio wasn't damaged BUT they complained to the CUL that the radio wasn't working right when the got back to mission base ???

Appendic C:  In 80-90% of the cases, your cell phone is a viable alternative and will work better.
Yep, did you know that even if you don't have a cellphone signal from a nearby cell tower and you dial 911, your cellphone will still get through ??? ::)  (per one cadet at recent face to face squadron comm training)  I think we need to practice hybrid cellphone/radio comms, knowing where we do have a cellphone signal as well as a good radio signal into the repeater and planning accordingly.  IF any aircraft is flying typical air/ground comms via a portable will work fine (if of course they are on the same channel, possibly another challenge).   Teams need to be "communications situationally aware" as to where they do have cellphone & radio repeater signals/access.

We need big-button devices with clear instructions.  The majority of operators do not care or need to know about radio theory, design, or the physics of radios waves, propagation, or atmospheric skip.
Agree with you, most radio operators don't need any theory other than with VHF/UHF comms the higher in elevation you can get the better chance for good comms.
Although they mean well with an on line course, it does require some "hands on experience" before final certification.  The ratio of operators to available radios is a  VERY, VERY significant training challenge :( >:( .  CAP'ers overall are interested in "bling" and high statistics (wow we got 60K radio operators), whether someone is proficient or not has no bearing on reality.  Senior MRO's, CUL's, & IC's basically know who REALLY can operate the radio proficiently and those personnel are utilized (perhaps with a few "motivated" trainees).  The others just carry around their "bling" for whatever it's worth in CAP ES fantasy land :angel:
RM


Eclipse

^ On #3 above.   Negative.  Set the radio to your assigned frequency and quit trying to be a HAM guy on a mission.

That's the problem. 

Every radio guy thinking they "know better" is off frequency monitoring the BK Lounge's drive through radios "just in case".

"That Others May Zoom"

EMT-83

Have to agree with Radioman on item #3.

At the recent NER SAREX, mission base and ground teams in our Wing were on digital repeater with aircraft on analog simplex (due to some older equipment in some aircraft).

We kept the radio in the van on scan and had to switch between analog and digital banks, plus change channel. Fortunately, the cadet on the radio was an MRO that had been instructed in how the EFJ actually works, not just turn it on and don't touch anything.

I didn't come up with the comm plan, we were just doing as we were told.

Capt Rivera

#3: It had to be done in ND at least once that I witnessed due to equipment issue with some A/C... Those issues may be resolved by now however...  Its not terrible to learn though depending on the volume of contacts...
//Signed//

Joshua Rivera, Capt, CAP
Squadron Commander
Grand Forks Composite Squadron
North Dakota Wing, Civil Air Patrol
http://www.grandforkscap.org

BK

Yet another reason for better training.

Did you know:  If the EF Johnson radio is in the scan mode, you can transmit on any scanned channel without moving any dials/switches, if the mic button is depressed within 2 seconds of receiving on a scanned channel; regardless of the zone and channel the radio is actually set to?  Pressing the mic button within 2 seconds of receiving a scanned channel will cause the radio to transmit on that scanned channel, not the channel it is set to.

See EF Johnson Operators Manual, paragraph 4.11.5 TRANSMITTING IN THE SCAN MODE.
William E. Kay, Colonel, CAP
Commander, ND Wing