(http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs147.snc3/17439_275484785058_167794755058_3876037_801652_n.jpg)
I believe you can see the video here without being a member of Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Chairman-Zachary-Z-King/167794755058
:o
Quote from: NIN on January 29, 2010, 05:19:41 PM
I believe you can see the video here without being a member of Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Chairman-Zachary-Z-King/167794755058
Nope.
LOL....
All I have to say.
^ Same here. I couldn't tell if some parts were a mockery of the Presidents address or not. Watch the hand gestures that seem to be forced and compare them to similar ones used by Obama the night before.
Honestly, I did not get much out of it other than there is going to be yet another website within the CAP website.
I have it on good authority that it wasn't a joke...
you should post it on youtube, for those of us that do not have a facebook account, like me
...wait, this wasn't just a joke?
wow.
Looking at his Facebook page, I have a feeling he let the position get to his head.
Quote from: OfficerT189 on January 30, 2010, 05:36:24 AM
you should post it on youtube, for those of us that do not have a facebook account, like me
You're able to view the video still, regardless of your Facebook membership status. All you have to do is bring up the link, and click the videos tab...its the first one from the left.
......
Probably should have not included the fake applause.
umm
The next Bill Clinton????
I have always been a huge supporter of the CAC, having been a Wing CAC Chairman in the past. However, stunts like this make it awfully hard to defend the CAC process.
For me to take this seriously, I would have to know Where and To Whom he was addressing (as indicated by the crowd "applause"), more about what the council is proactively doing besides another website, etc. In other words more substantial content, not just a huge fluff piece promoting C/LTC King.
Unfortunately, I'm hanging my head in shame.
Quote from: OfficerT189 on January 30, 2010, 05:36:24 AM
you should post it on youtube, for those of us that do not have a facebook account, like me
Its 15 minutes long. YouTube is limited to 10 minutes.
I'm having trouble wrapping my mind around the fact that the national CAC chair created a "Government Official" Facebook page for himself.
I couldn't even watch the video all the way through.
Yeah, I can't resist. I have to send this to all my CAP friends.
WHAT THE.......
This cannot be serious... I lasted 45 seconds...
Quote from: Pumbaa on January 30, 2010, 09:01:29 PM
WHAT THE.......
This cannot be serious... I lasted 45 seconds...
Masochist....
;D @ my brother.
"1) do you think his name was already 'King' or did he legally change it after being elected?"
Monitor him carefully; He may well be the Antichrist.....
Major Lord
When I saw that crap, I thought it was him alone. Unfortunately that is what NCAC is doing as a group effort. :)
He also has a chief of staff and a bunch of other staffers. *rolls eyes*
Quote from: USAFaux2004 on January 31, 2010, 12:25:57 AM
When I saw that crap, I thought it was him alone. Unfortunately that is what NCAC is doing as a group effort. :)
He also has a chief of staff and a bunch of other staffers. *rolls eyes*
Heey, heey... Not so quick. I have been watching the work that the NCAC has been doing and have seen some outstanding things that are beginning to be produced.
I've actually never posted on here before, but I thought this was pretty interesting.. Before I write anything, I don't want to start any debates with anyone- and most of you wont agree with my anyways.... But either way I just thought I'd write what I think.
I took the time to watch the whole speech because he took the time to "address the nation", and I figured it wasn't for nothing.. I was interested in what he said about the CAC and how everyone thinks they don't serve a purpose. I personally think he has guts to get up in front of everyone like that and come right out and say it... I would have never done it myself.
Although I think it was rather long, it lets the cadets on the lower levels get a better understanding of who he is and what he's trying to do. Whether you think it was necessary or not, that's a different story. But it was kinda cool.. I've never heard of an NCAC Chairman doing something like that before. The kid's got guts, IMO.
Hm. Maybe it was a bit cheesy with the applause and what not. I soo get that, haha. But maybe you should focus more on the content of the speech rather than how or where it was done....? IDK, I'm thinking about playing it for my home squadron to see how they feel about it..
I'm going to give the NCAC a chance this term. He made a few promises that caught my interest, but we'll see if the NCAC can follow through with what he said they would do.
Sorry this was so long. But what do you guys think? Do I make any sense at all?
-Swiper
^ Sure you make sense. However, what is the NCAC doing exactly?? Online testing I heard, but NHQ is rolling that out. What else did he say they are doing, as I found it difficult to pay attention as he kept saying how the NCAC is doing great things, but not mentioning anything other than how the NCAC would do "things".
Quote from: swiper on January 31, 2010, 01:26:11 AM
I've actually never posted on here before, but I thought this was pretty interesting.. Before I write anything, I don't want to start any debates with anyone- and most of you wont agree with my anyways.... But either way I just thought I'd write what I think.
I took the time to watch the whole speech because he took the time to "address the nation", and I figured it wasn't for nothing.. I was interested in what he said about the CAC and how everyone thinks they don't serve a purpose. I personally think he has guts to get up in front of everyone like that and come right out and say it... I would have never done it myself.
Although I think it was rather long, it lets the cadets on the lower levels get a better understanding of who he is and what he's trying to do. Whether you think it was necessary or not, that's a different story. But it was kinda cool.. I've never heard of an NCAC Chairman doing something like that before. The kid's got guts, IMO.
Hm. Maybe it was a bit cheesy with the applause and what not. I soo get that, haha. But maybe you should focus more on the content of the speech rather than how or where it was done....? IDK, I'm thinking about playing it for my home squadron to see how they feel about it..
I'm going to give the NCAC a chance this term. He made a few promises that caught my interest, but we'll see if the NCAC can follow through with what he said they would do.
Sorry this was so long. But what do you guys think? Do I make any sense at all?
-Swiper
+1
What I believe put into words...
-1
Sorry Swipe, Addo1,
Don't care.....the message was lost in transmission. One of the first steps of any communications is analyse your audience.....his audience is not going to buy the fake laugh track and fake applause track....not to mention the obvious camera cuts.
Quote from: lordmonar on January 31, 2010, 03:39:49 AM
-1
Sorry Swipe, Addo1,
Don't care.....the message was lost in transmission. One of the first steps of any communications is analyse your audience.....his audience is not going to buy the fake laugh track and fake applause track....not to mention the obvious camera cuts.
This.
And to Addo1, I was speaking of the facebook page, saying it's not just his idea alone.
The NCAC is trying to get into social media, but this is a step back from that...TBH, if any of my friends saw that, they'd probably laugh at me for being in CAP and think that we were practicing on how to be little dictators in 3rd world countries.
will the lower level cadets ever see this? If the donthave facebook, how will they know to look for it? Is there some sort of distribution plan for this viedo? I haventheardof it if there is any. So how does cadet Jones in East bfe get to hear these great words?
There are 285 fans of the Facebook page.....that means it is out there now.
The rule of twos....285 tell 2 people...those 570 tell 2 people...those 1140 tell 2 more....2280...4560.....everyone could know about this by next week!
CAC can't really be equated to congress, seeing as we can't really write any new policy, and we don't have any real authority within the program. All we can do is recommend changes to SMs. I also felt the whole speech was a bit over the top with the fake applause and jokes. That said, NCAC can come out with some good material. Hopefully they will this term.
I'm on Wing CAC...honestly, the hardest part about the program is getting the CAC echelon system to work with the chain of command.
for the love of JC..................... I thought when I wore diamonds I was full of myself, looking back........ I just watched the other videos. This guy must think he up there with the COS Air Force. ::)
When I was a group CAC chairman, my meetings were conducted at MacDill AFB and I recall thinking of myself as being the man ::) . I wished there was videos of my CAC days because we all would have laugh. On a serious note.........any cadts that serve on a CAC, I thank you for your time and effort . Dont let it go to your head,trust me I know. Do the right thing and do it for the cadets you repersent.
Quote from: lordmonar on January 31, 2010, 03:39:49 AM
-1
Sorry Swipe, Addo1,
Don't care.....the message was lost in transmission. One of the first steps of any communications is analyse your audience.....his audience is not going to buy the fake laugh track and fake applause track....not to mention the obvious camera cuts.
I totally get it, trust me. You're not wrong, but what I tried to say before is to not overlook the content of his speech. His intention was not to "wow" his online viewers with realistic applause, laughter, etc.. Every leader will have his or her opposition. There is absolutely no way around it. If a viewer (and I do not, in any way, mean this as a direct attack to anyone) is going to judge a message (directed to and FOR the viewer) on cheesy effects and bad camera handling, then what is that saying? He's not trying to sabotage Civil Air Patrol and ruin it for everyone else- he clearly wants to make it better. The saying "I'm only human" comes to mind.
So.... The audience not buying the fake laugh and applause? Maybe. But "lost in transmission"? I'm sorry but I just can't agree.
BTW, I personally think it's not about ego. I know it's rare, but maybe it's possible to be that sincere about something....? IDK. I'm more excited to see what the council has in store for the nation rather than doubtful that anything will ever get done. Trying to be optimistic, ya know? ;)
I think I'm going to take him up on his offer and send them an e-mail and request a copy of that report. I kinda wonder if anyone is even going to do that.. (if you didn't watch the whole video, he invited anyone to send the council a message requesting a copy of their annual report)
-Swiper
The bad camera work and cheesey effects obscurred the message. I did watch the how thing (and did not imbibe in adult beverages although it may have made more sense) and didn't get much of what was said because of the distractions.
Quote from: swiper on January 31, 2010, 05:41:33 AMBTW, I personally think it's not about ego.
I would be more inclined to agree if the video weren't posted on a page full of updates like "Chairman Zachary Z. King worked this morning to gather coats and warm clothing in a disaster relief effort to deliver to Joint Base McGuire-Dix-Lakehurt..." "Chairman Zachary Z. King is in route to the White House..." and plastered with photos of C/King attending various CAP functions.
I'm not opposed to NCAC having a Facebook presence, but their current "presence" reads like a massive self-promotion (I can think of a better term, but it's not even close to appropriate for this forum) for the current chairman, which carries into the videos posted.
WOW.
If you search for "Chairman Zachary King", his page comes up with the describing detail "Government Official."
Folks, keep in mind that it is becoming almost mandatory for leaders to have their own "promotional" facebook, twitter, etc. pages to highlight what they are doing, so I don't see this as a big departure from the norm.
However, personally I would have made it just a bit more focused on what the NCAC is doing rather than what the Chairman of the NCAC is doing.
As a cadet, I probably would have thought having a Facebook page for the NCAC would be a cool idea. In fact, I still do. And I think video updates are a great idea.
But this video isn't the half of it. There was another one a while back, where it looked like he had set up an office in his living room, complete with flags, a custom nameplate, you guess it. Having seen the National Commander's office and knowing it was less impressive than his setup, I wondered who he thought he was fooling.
A five speech I would support. A podium I can support. Even decking out in the service coat is okay. But a fifteen minute speech complete with a fake address to a nonexistent audience, a page where he can gather "fans", and his undying attempt to show the world how awesome he is leans more into the realm of either blatent self-promotion or delusion.
Must.... Resist.... Urge.... To.... Dogpile... "The Chairman"..... :-X
...just watched the office-living-room video. This guy must think he's the C/CC of CAP.
Spike, addo1, and the others are correct. Strick - you get your videos and I'll get my videos from the days when I was the Wing Chair and a large amount of adult beverages. I wouldn't be able to sit up the next day because my sides hurt too bad from laughing. But this is over the top. Also reinforces other discussions about eliminating non-milestone achievement ribbons and JROTC ribbons - he did look like a third-world dictator.
I am going to play this for my cadets this week. I want to get a pulse from them if they think it's cool, or if they think it is over the top. Who knows, we all might be dinosaurs becuase if the kids thinnk it is as cool as an ice cream in August, then things like this might help retention.
If they think it is over the top, then my faith in today's youth will be restored.
Thoughts?
Go ahead and play it as is with no indication of what you think about it and then ask for their feedback on the content as well as the format.
To test RiverAux's theory of there being content in the video, I went through and did a retrospective outline of the speech. This way, you won't have to watch it. :)
1) Introduction
2) The NCAC is in excellent shape
3) He did a lot of stuff in the CAC, and now is the chairman. And he's honored.
4) He's been in CAP for almost 9 years.
5) He, once again, did a lot of stuff in the CAC, and is now the chair. And he can't believe it.
6) He wants to increase the awareness of the CAC.
7) He believes a comparison can be drawn between Congress and the CAC.
8 ) He states the purpose of the address as a report on the activities and progress of the CAC.
9) He draws a comparison between the President's State of the Union address and his address to the cadets.
10) 3.5 minutes in, and he still is promising that he is going to talk to us about how the CAC is progressing. Eventually.
11) Acknowledges the negative perspective many people have of the CAC in terms of being out of touch and unproductive.
12) Tells us that he received great advice to "tell the truth" at summer boards.
13) Expresses desire to increase the communication between the CAC and the cadet program so that the cadets know what a good job they are doing.
14) Talks about new mediums of contact, including a CAC website and Facebook page.
15) Acknowledges that the CAC reps should keep their promises.
16) Talks about the need for every position in the CAC chain to be filled.
17) Draws a comparison between a deck of cards and the number of wings.
18) He announces his "final" point to discuss current achievements of the CAC at 7 minutes 22 seconds. We aren't even halfway through the video yet...
19) Mentions that he added on to the motto for the CAC.
20) Also states that he set forth the objective of setting objectives.
21) Says that the method to achieve objective is to always question the legacy that will be left by the council at the end of the term.
22) Blasts through a few points like online cadet testing, new leadership curriculum, squadron activity handbooks, whether the SDA program will be around, reviewing the CPFT, and the "cadet guidance program" without giving many solid details or any definite decisions on anything.
23) Wants to create CAC instructional videos.
24) Encourages us to look at the annual summary.
25) Talks about how cool he thinks the CAC is.
26) Quotes Kennedy from a State of the Union address.
27) The end.
Alright... so a summary of the summary.
The first four minutes are so are pretty much pure ego stroking. Then he talks about how the council is going to be different because they are going to start telling the truth and setting objectives, which I assumed to be common sense for ANY leadership position. He discusses some new mediums of contact, but doesn't really explain how they should be used in relation to sending information up the regular CAC chain. He does a bit more ego stroking, taking credit for apparently being revolutionary in telling the CAC that they need to figure out where they're going, and that the motivation should be to be remembered as being awesome.
Then he rushes through what I would consider to be the actual content. He talks about all the programs that the CAC has been considering and working on, but contrary to the beginning of his speech, does not tell us about any decisions. Only that they are working on all these neat ideas, and will hopefully have them done at some undisclosed time. Frankly, I already knew that.
Finally, he wraps up with some more CAC image polishing, and tells us goodbye.
Hrm...
I think the biggest giveaway of the whole speech was his admittance that his driving force is to be remembered by the cadets. Generally, people who are driven to make people remember them are not necessarily focused on actually doing anything productive. This speech was clearly an attempt to be remembered, and I'm pretty sure it worked. But, case in point, it told us NOTHING we didn't already know.
Well, that's not entirely true. I know a great deal more about C/Lt Col King's resume. I could probably write it for him. And I know, at least, that the CAC is still working on the same ideas that they've been working on. So at least they haven't gotten rid of any of the projects he stated.
So WAS there a good deal of content available? Not really. In my opinion, he probably would have done much better to expand about the programs the CAC was working on, and less about how cool and important he and the rest of the CAC actually was. Ironically enough, we would KNOW how awesome the CAC is if he spent all that time telling us everything it was accomplishing. He wouldn't need to state its awesomeness for us to know about it.
Just another irony. I find it ironic how, despite his promise to not be "out of touch" with the cadet program, he apparently is oblivious to the general opinion of this video by most CAP members. :)
I would think if Cadet King were interested in communicating with CAP members in general and Cadets in particular, he would have had his speech posted on the CAP Channel, not on his facebook page.
Quote from: Cecil DP on January 31, 2010, 08:18:51 PM
I would think if Cadet King were interested in communicating with CAP members in general and Cadets in particular, he would have had his speech posted on the CAP Channel, not on his facebook page.
Probably due to a lack of knowledge or contacts on how to do that. Or, he felt the Public Relations/Marketing folks would laugh him out of office.
Quote from: Nathan on January 31, 2010, 07:56:24 PM
7) He believes a comparison can be drawn between Congress and the CAC.
The most apt comparison is that the members of both bodies believe that the bodies themselves are an end, instead of a means. Since the
video was made a available only to a select audience, I cannot view it, however if Nathan's summary is accurate, the above should be obvious.
There's nothing there that would light the fire of local CAC's.
I normally don't check captalk often but I heard through the grapevine about C/Lt Col King's address and I had to check it out. Truthfully, set aside from some of the little corny applause and the camera cuts, I think he did an outstanding job (I dont think they have a huge budget or any at all to accomplish this address so I wasn't expecting greatness). I cant think of any other CAC Leader who has done this in the past. When you think about it, what makes his address any different from any other leader, officer, or commander's Address that are posted throughout the year? I think it takes initiative to post a video speaking directly to cadets and telling them what is going on at the top. I understand some of you think it is cheesy but most of you are Cadet Officers who have been in this organization for numerous years. How about the 12 year old Airman who stumbles across this. The C/Amn relates this to the Presidents Address and he is proud to see that CAC is functioning much like the Democracy in which every cadet has the ability to voice his or her own opinions.
On another note, I did check out his, along with the NCAC, facebook. I think its a great way to network with cadets. Facebook is a growing "Global Community". Everyone is on facebook, from C/Amn to C/Col, along with Senior Members, active duty military, and all of CAP Civilian Affiliates. Even government officials such as Congressman and Senators have facebooks. Admiral Mullen, who has his own page, even spoke out about the value of Social Networking and how it should be embraced as a vital tool in today's society. Its expanding the CAC Mission/Vision to the Nation.
In regards to his facebook. You say that he promotes himself? Sure! Who doesn't! Everyone wants to post the great things that they are a part of or contributing to. This builds a good image for him and the NCAC. Would you rather him post his personal issues, or that he's helping collect clothing for Haiti and working countless hours to contribute to CAP, AFROTC, and his local community. I for one am glad to know he hasn't fallen to the mindless stuff that we have all fallen to on facebook. He uses it to inspire and promote hard work and efficiency. He is merely being accountable and showing us that he along with the NCAC are being proactive during this term.
Whether or not you watched it or not your missing the big issues. Why not take advantage of his initiative to help better the Cadet Program. I stumbled across a great quote the other day that I thought I would never use. Turns out here's a perfect scenario.
"Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people." -- Eleanor Roosevelt.
Why cant we look past the corny effects/sounds and stop assuming he has personal motives. Lets focus on what can be approved in the Cadet Program and in CAP as a whole.
Personally, I am excited that cadets are talking about the NCAC initiative. I am hoping for good things to happen this term. Hopefully all of you will see where I am coming from.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on January 31, 2010, 09:02:44 PMEveryone is on facebook, from C/Amn to C/Col, along with Senior Members, active duty military, and all of CAP Civilian Affiliates.
No, they aren't.
"In regards to his facebook. You say that he promotes himself? Sure! Who doesn't! Everyone wants to post the great things that they are a part of or contributing to. This builds a good image for him and the NCAC."
What is the purpose of the page? To further promote yourself (for things outside of CAP) and what you do or the NCAC and what they are accomplishing? There is a difference between arrogance and pride. Arrogance in look at me is a turn off. Pride in what the NCAC accomplishes is a positive image. The page should have been about the NCAC.
Agreed. An "NCAC" page (similar to how other organizations have a Facebook page for the organization itself) would have been much more appropriate.
The current page is less about the NCAC, and more about C/King as head of the NCAC.
Quote from: raivo on February 01, 2010, 12:00:41 AM
Agreed. An "NCAC" page (similar to how other organizations have a Facebook page for the organization itself) would have been much more appropriate.
The current page is less about the NCAC, and more about C/King as head of the NCAC.
That's another irritating thing about this...there already is a page for NCAC on Facebook.
In regards to Eclipse. You are right. "Everyone" is not on facebook, but like I said its a "Growing Community" and a large portion of CAP is on Facebook. Whether or not they can reach everyone is not relavent. It is nearly impossible to reach everyone unless this was a perfect world. Facebook does allow the NCAC to reach a much larger audience then it ever has in the past. Not just the top cadets but the lower ranking cadets too. If a group of well informed cadets know what the NCAC is doing then they can spread the word in their home squadrons. Its a great way to indirectly reach cadets. Meanwhile the CAC Echelon Structure is still active and working. Its not like facebook is taking over as the primary communication source of the NCAC. Facebook is only adding another channel of approach.
Farrier and raivo- I believe you have some of your facts mixed up. There are two seperate pages: one for Chairman Zachary King and another for the NCAC as a whole. The links are provided below. I do not see how his facebook page is any different from any other CAP Member's Social Networking Site. We are all proud of our titles and accomplishments. He is putting a good name to NCAC by showing how he is working hard to improve the cadet program.
When all is said and done though you are still missing the big issue. You are attacking the person instead of actually looking at the message.
http://www.facebook.com/tos.php?api_key=1be4e0bda1579c60f8ed7017f4ad93ff&next=photos.php&v=1.0&canvas#/pages/Chairman-Zachary-Z-King/167794755058?ref=ts
http://www.facebook.com/tos.php?api_key=1be4e0bda1579c60f8ed7017f4ad93ff&next=photos.php&v=1.0&canvas#/pages/Washington-DC/The-Civil-Air-Patrol-National-Cadet-Advisory-Council/159922788540?ref=ts
Wow! And he's not embarrassed about this?
Quote from: Gunner C on February 01, 2010, 12:51:29 AM
Wow! And he's not embarrassed about this?
No offense or anything...... but why should he be? I don't think he would have posted it if he was embarassed about it. Would you put up a video intended to reach out to the nation if you didn't feel confident with the material you were presenting? Or with how you presented it? He's got to be... 19-20 years old? For someone who isn't the president, that was pretty good in my book.
It's almost a natural reaction for me to try to find the positives in something such as this, because what good will it do to point out all the things that I thought he "could have done better with"?
No one can honestly say that they know if he was doing it for ego, or to get his own name out there. If you believe that, then fine, I respect you opinion. But all I know is that the whole video wasn't an "into on the chairman" or some fake interview or something made so he could talk about himself.
I don't care what he may have said about himself in the beginning, one thing is for sure...It was an address TO the cadets FOR the cadets.. (and besides, I think that's what an intro is supposed to be, especially if he was trying to speak to people such as new cadets who have never heard or seen him before)
For me, what it comes down to is what I took away from it, which is that there is someone out there trying to make a better cadet program for me and the cadets who follow after me.
Like I said before, for someone who
isn't. the. president. he did alright.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 12:46:23 AMI do not see how his facebook page is any different from any other CAP Member's Social Networking Site.
Facebook has two main "types" of profiles. There are the "personal" profiles (which I have), and the "official" profiles which are usually used by companies, organizations, public figures, and the like. I just find it amusing that C/King apparently found it appropriate to set himself up an "official" profile (and tag it as "Government Official") which are usually used by folks like President Obama, Admiral Mullen, or who-have-you. Heck, the Air Force Chief of Staff doesn't even have an official Facebook profile.
The focus of CAC is supposed to be about serving the cadet body. From what I've seen of the chairman, he seems excessively concerned with self-promotion. And if that's really the case, I have to question whether he is really the right man for the job.
Im not as concerned with whether or not he is or is not "the man for the job" as I am with the fact that you would judge him off of "what you have seen". I just hope that you have at least met with him or seen him in person before you make that kind of statement. I've met him 3-4 times at cadet competitions, national activities, and Wreaths Across America in DC this year..... He's nothing like what most of these negative posts reflect.
From what I know about CAC, he was elected into the position by people who were elected into their position, by people who were elected into that position, by people who were elected to that position, by people who were appointed to their position..... So no one can help the fact that the NCAC representatives clearly felt he was.... dare I say it? .... "the man for the job".
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 12:46:23 AMFacebook is only adding another channel of approach.
Yes, and anyone who really knows anything about marketing will tell you that when you improperly segment your message, you do so at the risk of the message.
The mere fact that we are having this discussion
about someone who isn't here to defend or explain themselves shows the risk of "social" media. I'm sure similar conversations are being had all over the place.
Considering that the CAC is a
cadet body, nothing should ever be released or executed without the review and approval of senior members. Further, anything considered as "official" for CAP should only be posted on official CAP sources, which conversely means nothing not on a CAP website should ever be construed as "official".
Frankly the situation basically defines the problem he is seeking to fix, that the CAC is expressly broken, and operates today on vague, squishy, mantras and mission statements without clearly stated, achievable, goals at any level.
They exist to exist. Period.
Quote from: swiper on February 01, 2010, 02:07:49 AM
Im not as concerned with whether or not he is or is not "the man for the job" as I am with the fact that you would judge him off of "what you have seen". I just hope that you have at least met with him or seen him in person before you make that kind of statement. I've met him 3-4 times at cadet competitions, national activities, and Wreaths Across America in DC this year..... He's nothing like what most of these negative posts reflect.
I'm sure he's a very articulate, capable young man with a bright future.
What has he actually
done, and what has he indicated he intends to
do?
On a side note why exactly does he have a white shirt and black tie with the service coat?
Quote from: maverik on February 01, 2010, 02:18:09 AM
On a side note why exactly does he have a white shirt and black tie with the service coat?
Bad lighting.
Its been one of the marks against the CSU, because it can be hard to distinguish between light blue and white in bad lighting.
^ If you are color blind, or a mile away. In person, most everyone is able to distinguish between white and blue. Throw in the CAP Cutouts, the silver sleeve braid and the general "heaviness" of the wearer of the CSU, it is actually very distinguishable.
When you create a facebook page there are actually three options, one for a "Local" Person, one for a "Brand, Product, and Organization" (like the NCAC), and one for a "Artist, Band, or Public Figure". If you read his credentials you can see that he is involved with numerous organizations outside of CAP and he is Chairman for several. So Public Figure would best suit his criteria. Once this has been established their is an option to choose which "Public Figure" description best suits you. Actor, Athlete, Band, Comedian, Critic, Government Official, Model, Musician, Politician, Sports Team, Visual Artist, or Writer. A government official is an official who is involved in public administration or government, through either election, appointment, selection, or employment. I think C/Lt Col King more than fits this definition in more than one of his current positions held.
Truthfully, if the council isn't complaining about his actions and has actually promoted his actions, then I do not think there is an issue. Like I said instead of questioning or attacking his motives why not harness his eagerness to succeed. If he looks good then the council looks good, if the council looks good then CAP looks good.
Social Networking sites are merely a backup to the already established communication process inside of the CAC Structure. Not to replace it. I think the problem lies somewhere in the middle or the lower CAC Structure, not at the NCAC level. From what I can see, the NCAC and C/Lt Col King himself have been working diligently to close this gap. Also, I have heard that the Senior Advisor of the NCAC is well aware of the Facebook activity. If anyone would have a problem with it, he would be the first one to speak up.
Honestly, there's no need for him to have his own fan page on facebook. Every video he has made can be posted on the NCAC facebook profile. I don't know about other facebook users, but unless the person is a celebrity, etc, fan pages for individuals usually are seen as jokes.
And I just checked-none of these videos are on the NCAC facebook page.
Quote from: JoeTomasone on January 31, 2010, 04:22:27 PM
Must.... Resist.... Urge.... To.... Dogpile... "The Chairman"..... :-X
(http://www.frank-sinatra.org/franksinatra.jpg)
Kinda hard to dogpile a dead guy. Oh, wait, that's "The Chairman of the Board," not just "The Chairman."
(http://thetwocentscorp.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/markdacascos_e1.jpg)
Maybe this guy? Allez Cuisine!
Quote from: B.Kahuna on February 01, 2010, 12:35:57 AM
Quote from: raivo on February 01, 2010, 12:00:41 AM
Agreed. An "NCAC" page (similar to how other organizations have a Facebook page for the organization itself) would have been much more appropriate.
The current page is less about the NCAC, and more about C/King as head of the NCAC.
That's another irritating thing about this...there already is a page for NCAC on Facebook.
there are at least three of them.
I only see one fan page and one group...
The fan pages for NCAC and the Chairman as you can see are updated frequently. The group has not been updated in several months. I think this was a test run for the NCAC Social Networking Site. I think C/Lt Col King has been already "dogpiled". Everyone hopped on CAPTalk to judge his motives and did not focus on what he spoke about. Check out his posts rather than where he posted it.
So far every post I have read on this Blog has focused on a minute issue about his character, uniform, or camerawork, which is irrelevant. As long as he is representing CAP and the CAC in a professional manner, lets move on and embrace the resources that are present. If you have an issue with the Chairman, contact him directly. If he ignores you than your judgements are correct, but if he responds I guess he can put his duty before his "supposed" motives and your argument's are then void. Honestly, I see all of this communication as being a form of gossip.
After reading this thread, it sounds like a complete waste of time to click over to Facebook or YouTube. You guys have done it for me.
Just from the "ad" at the top of this thread, it all sounds way too pretentious and overblown. It even has its own "logo," like the Obama O. Why? What's the point? Someone's getting a little carried away. Next thing you know, someone will come up with a silly shield-shaped emblem for the NCAC and someone else will start pushing for it to be a separate command under the national commander or something.
All that said, at some point this thread starts to bash, so please, let's be careful. Like I haven't made fun of authoritah creep in CAP already....
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 03:15:35 AM
The fan pages for NCAC and the Chairman as you can see are updated frequently. The group has not been updated in several months. I think this was a test run for the NCAC Social Networking Site. I think C/Lt Col King has been already "dogpiled". Everyone hopped on CAPTalk to judge his motives and did not focus on what he spoke about. Check out his posts rather than where he posted it.
So far every post I have read on this Blog has focused on a minute issue about his character, uniform, or camerawork, which is irrelevant. As long as he is representing CAP and the CAC in a professional manner, lets move on and embrace the resources that are present. If you have an issue with the Chairman, contact him directly. If he ignores you than your judgements are correct, but if he responds I guess he can put his duty before his "supposed" motives and your argument's are then void. Honestly, I see all of this communication as being a form of gossip.
No I don't think he has been dog piled enough.
I did listen to his message. I heard his message back in September at the NCAC meeting...guess what....same message. So his state of the CAC is....nothing has changed in six months.....
So....after looking at the message let's look at the damage that the messanger caused.
Can you really say that any outside observer would take the NCAC seriously now? As I said before.....if he has spend as much time on the message instead of the bells and whistles.....maybe we would have a real message.
You say that nothing matters so long as he is representing CAP in a professional manner.....but that is our point....he is not. He is making himself, the NCAC and CAP a joke with his state of the council address.
Quote from: lordmonar on February 01, 2010, 04:40:26 AMSo....after looking at the message let's look at the damage that the messanger caused.
Can you really say that any outside observer would take the NCAC seriously now? As I said before.....if he has spend as much time on the message instead of the bells and whistles.....maybe we would have a real message.
You say that nothing matters so long as he is representing CAP in a professional manner.....but that is our point....he is not. He is making himself, the NCAC and CAP a joke with his state of the council address.
Bingo.
Now, as interesting as this discussion is, I'm a bit busy at the moment chronicling my achievements for the brand new "Section Leader Raivo" page on Facebook. (Fans welcome!)
Quote from: swiper on February 01, 2010, 02:07:49 AM
Im not as concerned with whether or not he is or is not "the man for the job" as I am with the fact that you would judge him off of "what you have seen".
I'm going to throw two quote out here, and then discuss them.
"First impressions are lasting impressions."
"Performance talks; BS walks."
I have been on both sides of each quote, myself.
My first impression is that he is egotistical and self-serving. I couldn't get past the first thirty seconds of his most recent video. I watched almost a minute of his first video. Neither gave me a favorable first impression. I have seen nothing else, other than his having reached C/LtCol, of a favorable nature. There many other folks who hang out on CT, of equal or lesser cadet grade, who show me a lot more, based entirely on what I "see" here.
As for the second - what performance? He has, to date, shown us nothing. What more can I say?
Quote from: SarDragon on February 01, 2010, 05:27:42 AM
I'm going to throw two quote out here, and then discuss them.
"First impressions are lasting impressions."
"Performance talks; BS walks."
And a third: "Perception dictates reality."
I along with several other CADETS, thought he was sincere, and that he took a straightforward approach to his address. Besides a few corny camera cuts and the applause, he did nothing wrong.
You said he has done nothing, but from what I see, he along with the NCAC has worked hard to accomplish these tasks. Right now, on facebook, I can see that they're working to prepare for the Winter National Board and Legislative Day. Ive participated in Legislative Day before with my squadron and I think that's an outstanding way to promote CAP. Also, during that entire weekend the NCAC will be meeting and working. So you say he hasn't accomplished anything but I see that the NCAC has done a ton. The term isn't over yet and the Winter National Board is where the majority of the work gets done for both the NCAC and NHQ. After that, if nothing is accomplished then I encourage you to contact him yourself. Ive also read some of the minutes and agenda items. I for one am looking forward to the Cadet Activities Handbook and now I am extremely looking forward to the CAC Film Production (maybe that will be better).
Raivo- I understand your sarcasm, but understand, This is a CIVILIAN based organization. If you want to create a fan page for yourself you are legally allowed to.
The ironic thing is I dont see too many cadets complaining, maybe about the cheesy effects, but nothing against his misrepresentation or question of motives.
Anyway.... I will leave you with three quotes:
"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people." -Eleanor Roosevelt
"To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing." -Elbert Hubbard
"The only person dumber than a fool is one who argues with one"- Proverbs
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 05:58:18 AM...and that he took a straightforward approach to his address. Besides a few corny camera cuts and the applause, he did nothing wrong.
That is a contradiction right there. There was nothing about this production that was straight forward. If he had a single camera angel and just did the speech....added a fade in and fade out with a little music....that would have been straight forward.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 05:58:18 AMYou said he has done nothing, but from what I see, he along with the NCAC has worked hard to accomplish these tasks. Right now, on facebook, I can see that they're working to prepare for the Winter National Board and Legislative Day.
Prepared in what way? I want to know about the cadet knowledge base application where cadets could give input directly to the NCAC that was discussed at the National Boards. I want to know specifically how the new cadet beta testing is going. I want to know about what specific input the NCAC provided to the new leadership manuals.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 05:58:18 AMIve participated in Legislative Day before with my squadron and I think that's an outstanding way to promote CAP. Also, during that entire weekend the NCAC will be meeting and working. So you say he hasn't accomplished anything but I see that the NCAC has done a ton. The term isn't over yet and the Winter National Board is where the majority of the work gets done for both the NCAC and NHQ. After that, if nothing is accomplished then I encourage you to contact him yourself. Ive also read some of the minutes and agenda items. I for one am looking forward to the Cadet Activities Handbook and now I am extremely looking forward to the CAC Film Production (maybe that will be better).
Again....a lot of stuff he could have put into his speech.....instead we got a bunch of nothing...with a laugh track and applause track.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 05:58:18 AM...Raivo- I understand your sarcasm, but understand, This is a CIVILIAN based organization. If you want to create a fan page for yourself you are legally allowed to.
No...this is a military based organisation. We are the civilian axillary to the USAF.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 05:58:18 AMThe ironic thing is I dont see too many cadets complaining, maybe about the cheesy effects, but nothing against his misrepresentation or question of motives.
Well maybe we are lucky that most cadets never saw this thing.
Quote from: TheMuscle1007 on February 01, 2010, 05:58:18 AMAnyway.... I will leave you with three quotes:
"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people." -Eleanor Roosevelt
"To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing." -Elbert Hubbard
"The only person dumber than a fool is one who argues with one"- Proverbs
HAHAHA
You see the irony in this?
"This is a CIVILIAN based organization. If you want to create a fan page for yourself you are legally allowed to."
Sure, but it would be awfully silly.
Anyways, we're arguing in circles now, so... I've said my piece, I'll leave it be now.
Cadet King seems to have taken his "State of the Council" video off his web site.
Quote from: Cecil DP on February 01, 2010, 12:43:02 PM
Cadet King seems to have taken his "State of the Council" video off his web site.
About time.
I'm just going to address a couple of thing, so people don't think that we're looking for excuses to go after the guy.
I don't really care if he had nothing to say that was important. In fact, it's pretty much expected. I'm not going to hold it against him that as the NCAC chair, he has nothing new to say, especially since I never held the position and imagine it's a difficult position to fill in terms of pushing new things forward AND having some semblance of a life outside of CAP.
But here's what I do have a problem with.
1) Empty speeches are not uncommon when they are mandated. This one was not. He CHOSE to give this speech, and did so with the expectation that he would be presenting some sort of new information. He did not, which makes me personally question the purpose of the speech. There are a couple of possibilities, but the obvious one is ego fulfillment. Not really many reasons a person would give a speech that apparently was NOT mandated by NHQ, did NOT say anything new, and that he could have canceled at any time. Instead, not only did he go through with it, but he did it with flair...
2) The things he talked about, as I said earlier, are nothing new. They do not say that he's actually accomplished anything specific, despite his insistence that he HAS accomplished things. In fact, all I heard him say that HAS happened is that he is now going to be telling the truth and setting objectives. Unless C/Col Dumont was completely blind in terms of running ANY cadet program, let alone the NCAC, then I have a hard time imagining these things weren't already in place. All we heard, instead, was that there were a bunch of programs that the NCAC either has been working on for a while or wanted to start thinking about maybe in the future possibly voting to consider that they wanted to work on it. And for those of us in the know (generally from message boards like CAPTalk and CadetStuff), we are definitely aware that none of the programs he talked about were new ideas, and that means he essentially is announcing that he accomplished... nothing.
3) It has been brought up that he cares about pushing the image of the NCAC further by doing this. That is entirely possible. However, I also realize that if I were in his position, AND I wanted to release a video that boosted the image and popularity of the NCAC, I 100% without question would have not released this video directly to Facebook with what appears to be absolutely no senior oversight. This guy had a national PAO that probably could have been working with him to make this video work really well. The fact that he released it by himself through a page he controls seems indicative of ulterior motivations.
4) The fact that no cadets have spoken against it yet (publicly) isn't really indicative of anything at all. First off, I'm going to guess that there is the fact that the number of cadets on CAPTalk that are active generally is small compared to the number of active seniors. Second, the cadets that have felt the need to speak up are (from what I can tell) CAC reps, and while I'm definitely not going to accuse anyone of brown-nosing, they at least have a vested interest in not wiping out their boss on the internet if they disagree with what he did. Third, if a cadet did see this at 12 years old, it may have actually done what the opposition says and made the cadet think, "Cool! This guy is really working!". Frankly, that doesn't change motivations of C/King, nor does it mean that he is (based off that video) the type of leader I want my cadets to emulate.
5) Which brings me to the "don't judge him 'till you've met him" argument. Sorry, not really applicable to a public figure, especially if said figure CHOOSES to make himself public. I put my name out here for anyone to see, which means that while members may not have a particularly good idea of what I'm like in person based off of what I write, it means that they have every right to have a mental picture in their mind formed on my public internet presence. Likewise, C/King made a choice to put himself on the internet. In fact, he really went out of his way to do it. If we're judging people based off of actions, then the posting of the video and the video itself both provide valid material.
As I said, I do not have a problem with the emptiness of the speech. And I most certainly do not have a problem with C/King himself. It's the fact that he decided to put out a flamboyant video on a fan site dedicated to him for no evidential reason that makes me question whether or not this was a self-promotion attempt in disguise as an "official" action to promote the NCAC. THAT would be what I have a problem with.
EDIT: I had this written shortly before it was posted that the video was taken down, and didn't really want it all to go to waste. But given that it is gone, I'm going to go ahead and drop the discussion from my end, since I imagine he was either smart enough to take it down or told to do so by NHQ, and I'm willing to respect either decision.
What a great kid! A real go-getter!
Major Lord
Quote from: Major Lord on February 01, 2010, 02:13:12 PM
a pervasive pattern of grandiosity
That pretty much nails that FB page. Captain Tomasone also dislikes first-person narratives self-written by people in the third person.
Look I have no problem with FB. I'm on FB and even the USJFCOM where I work has a FB page. But pUUuuulleeeze! Let's not be so over the top.
Quote from: JoeTomasone on February 01, 2010, 02:17:24 PM
Quote from: Major Lord on February 01, 2010, 02:13:12 PM
a pervasive pattern of grandiosity
That pretty much nails that FB page. Captain Tomasone also dislikes first-person narratives self-written by people in the third person.
We are amused by your retort!
The Major Lord
I noticed this morning that your Cadet King, or whoever operates the site, pulled the video down from the facebook page. I am really debating whether or not sending him a message asking him why he decided to do so. If anything, I am going to send a message asking for that report he mentioned. I am interested to see it when it is published.
I am not a member of your organization, though I am familiar with Civil Air Patrol.
Now, I am not posting to offend any of you; you have every right to speak your mind. Freedom of speech is nice, isn't it?
As an outsider, I took no offense to his address. Sound enhancement, camera cuts, bad lighting... that's what you guys are harping on? I know you are a nonprofit, so I imagine there wasn't a budget for him to make this film. It just seems like he was trying to make something out of nothing. I can understand that: building something from scratch with little to work with.
Your perception is your reality, and I get that, but I think you are confusing arrogance with confidence. There is a difference in being arrogant in character and arrogant in action. I previously did not know who he was, so the first however many seconds built a background for me. It told me he knew what he was doing based on years of experience. I think your young cadets can look up to that. It seems to me, they would have opportunities to look forward to.
I liked the quote the one guy on here gave from Eleanor Roosevelt. FDR was one of my favorite presidents, and Eleanor was a great woman. I am glad that your Cadet King is thinking big, "discussing ideas."
He is out there, trying to do something, trying to make a difference; and I do not think it is self-serving or that he is bragging, I think he is being accountable by trying to tell you, both in the video, and on the facebook page.
I served in the military, and I have worked in business. In the business world, there are times when it is cut-throat, and ego is everything. There's nothing wrong with ego. My take on your posts is that each of you feel challenged and that you had your ego attacked. If you say you do not feel that way, well, then you should, because this kid's got something! He reminds me a lot of me and many of my fellow general officers. I think this boys vision is great! I hope he can achieve it, despite the opposition.
I am the CEO of a company, and I would hire a guy like your Cadet King to come work for me any day. As for the rest of you, enjoy your freedom of speech that my buddies and I served to protect for over forty years. I just hope that you put as much time as you do posting on here with complaints as you do asserting efforts in pursuit of constructive projects that are going to help your organization and its members.
In the service, you would never do this to one of your own. At the end of the day, you are all on the same team. That is what is offensive from all of this: not his video, but the fact that members like you would chastise to such a degree one of your own.
That's my outside input. I'll leave you all to your "small-minded discussion of people..." rather than "ideas."
Regards,
Folks,
All cadets in CAP participate in a leadership laboratory. Unlike some youth programs, we place a great emphasis on cadets actually leading others and place them in positions of great responsibility (under senior member supervision).
WIWAC, I think I did some terrific things. On the other hand, I also had some monumental failures in judgment as I was attempting to do great things. (Buy me a beer and ask Jenkins or me about kazoos at encampment review ceremonies sometime.)
I guess the point is that we expect every cadet to overcome challenges and sometimes their performances are less than we (or they) expect. Indeed, the ability to fail in a safe environment and learn from it is the hallmark of our program.
I submit that publicly and permanently (in the internet sense) pointing out perceived failures of individual cadets is not what we should be doing. Indeed, it is kinda the opposite of what responsible seniors do. This is especially troubling when we do it by name and in a way that will follow the cadet forever (as long as Google survives.)
So, accept my personal request to resist the temptation to do so any further. The video under discussion has been taken down. Everyone involved is learning from the experience in the finest tradition of our program.
In the future, if you come across items that concern CP at the national level, please feel free to contact NHQ instead of spreading the problem over the internet. As you know, we have incredibly dedicated full time corporate team members working every day at NHQ who can and do respond quickly when necessary.
Also, we have dedicated volunteer CP leaders at the National level, including a former NB member whose current full time CAP assignment is to serve as the NCAC advisor, Col Larry Trick.
All it takes is a quick email or phone call. I know that is certainly less fun than publicly ridiculing a college student about his communications skills, but it is quicker and more effective.
And I submit, more professional.
All of you are free to email me or call me with CP concerns 24/7. It is my job.
Now, let it go . . . .
Ned Lee
Lt Col, CAP
National Cadet Advisor
(Contact information easily available on eServices, not repeated here simply to avoid bot-harvest)
Agreed. I could probably have kept a few of my thoughts to myself, but it is what it is now.
Although I will comment that I find it peculiar that three of the participants in this thread only registered their accounts in the last three days, and apparently for the sole purpose of commenting here.
Peculiar.
Quote from: raivo on February 01, 2010, 06:27:39 PM
Agreed. I could probably have kept a few of my thoughts to myself, but it is what it is now.
Although I will comment that I find it peculiar that three of the participants in this thread only registered their accounts in the last three days, and apparently for the sole purpose of commenting here.
Peculiar.
Not peculiar, but purposeful.
Ned is right though. No matter how much of joke this was or how wrong of an idea to do a presentation in that manner, it is a learning experience for that Cadet, and we should all shut up and move on to stuff like uniforms or what Wing is worst.
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
I served in the military, and I have worked in business. In the business world, there are times when it is cut-throat, and ego is everything. There's nothing wrong with ego. My take on your posts is that each of you feel challenged and that you had your ego attacked. If you say you do not feel that way, well, then you should, because this kid's got something! He reminds me a lot of me and many of my fellow general officers. I think this boys vision is great! I hope he can achieve it, despite the opposition.
As for the rest of you, enjoy your freedom of speech that my buddies and I served to protect for over forty years.
In the service, you would never do this to one of your own.
I looked through the posts and of all the folks that posted in this discussion, 9 are current, former or retired military. So don't tell me military folks don't eat their own. And don't act like you're the sole provider of freedom while we're just a bunch of unpaid volunteers. There are many campaign medals to go around here.
If nothing else, these 5 pages of messages shows one thing (among many others).
We should really reconsider not allowing folks to join anonymously.
The service would "never do this to one of (their) own"? The Haditha Marines? Col West? The Seals currently on trial? And lets not forget our own beloved Billy Mitchell, who was thrown out like a paper prophylactic when his opinions did not track with the brass.....
As far as trashing a cadet for publicly embarrassing CAP, I understand Ned's instinct to try and keep it in-house. Unfortunately, when it goes out on Facebook, Youtube, MTV, etc. the cats well out of the bag...I maintain that the public domain is the most appropriate domain to discuss a public fiasco. Our attempts at letting the system work in secret and trusting those in the appropriate echelon to handle things, resulted in cataclysmic damage to CAP and many members. Of course, I am not comparing this problem to Tony Pineda (AKA, Lord Vodemort, HWSNBN, Etc.) but only the mechanism of exposing problems to the light of day.
Major Lord
Why is there still discussion about this? I thought Ned's post would be the last. Just let it go folks. Move on. Nothing to see here.
Would make sense to use CAPID as part of signup here.
^^ Cause who is going to validate that? ???
Quote from: SilverEagle2 on February 01, 2010, 09:18:45 PM
^^ Cause who is going to validate that? ???
There are any number of people on this board with the access to validate CAP membership, however that would change the
dynamics of this forum in a direction that the mods do not support.
FWIW, I'd prefer it if this was restricted to members-only, since I have no idea why someone who isn't a current member would care
enough to participate in these generally trivial discussions. At the point that I separate from CAP (for whatever reason), River will
have the 2MFT stars all to himself.
I can't believe how quickly the video was removed. Sounds like somebody got a phone call.
Quote from: Major Lord on February 01, 2010, 09:00:52 PM
The service would "never do this to one of (their) own"? The Haditha Marines? Col West? The Seals currently on trial? And lets not forget our own beloved Billy Mitchell, who was thrown out like a paper prophylactic when his opinions did not track with the brass.....
Not to mention Admiral Kimmel, Admiral Boorda, Maj Gen Terry Schwalier, the two F-15 technicans in Germany (one committed suicide), the Airborn Battle Manager in the blackhawk shoot down in Northern Iraq....there is a long list of miitary people who get thrown under the bus for one reason or another.
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
He reminds me a lot of me and many of my fellow general officers. I am the CEO of a company, and I would hire a guy like your Cadet King to come work for me any day. ... enjoy your freedom of speech that my buddies and I served to protect for over forty years.
I guess the General is sending King a job offer as we speak....
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
...me and many of my fellow general officers. I think this boys vision is great!
Generals write english goodly?
So......bascally, did someone creat these new accounts?
Maybe, maybe not.
Strange coincidence, though.
Pendragon = Cadet King's father???
Don't know if it's true or not. But from the tone of his post, I wouldn't bet against it either.
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
I noticed this morning that your Cadet King, or whoever operates the site, pulled the video down from the facebook page. I am really debating whether or not sending him a message asking him why he decided to do so. If anything, I am going to send a message asking for that report he mentioned. I am interested to see it when it is published.
I am not a member of your organization, though I am familiar with Civil Air Patrol.
Now, I am not posting to offend any of you; you have every right to speak your mind. Freedom of speech is nice, isn't it?
As an outsider, I took no offense to his address. Sound enhancement, camera cuts, bad lighting... that's what you guys are harping on? I know you are a nonprofit, so I imagine there wasn't a budget for him to make this film. It just seems like he was trying to make something out of nothing. I can understand that: building something from scratch with little to work with.
Your perception is your reality, and I get that, but I think you are confusing arrogance with confidence. There is a difference in being arrogant in character and arrogant in action. I previously did not know who he was, so the first however many seconds built a background for me. It told me he knew what he was doing based on years of experience. I think your young cadets can look up to that. It seems to me, they would have opportunities to look forward to.
I liked the quote the one guy on here gave from Eleanor Roosevelt. FDR was one of my favorite presidents, and Eleanor was a great woman. I am glad that your Cadet King is thinking big, "discussing ideas."
He is out there, trying to do something, trying to make a difference; and I do not think it is self-serving or that he is bragging, I think he is being accountable by trying to tell you, both in the video, and on the facebook page.
I served in the military, and I have worked in business. In the business world, there are times when it is cut-throat, and ego is everything. There's nothing wrong with ego. My take on your posts is that each of you feel challenged and that you had your ego attacked. If you say you do not feel that way, well, then you should, because this kid's got something! He reminds me a lot of me and many of my fellow general officers. I think this boys vision is great! I hope he can achieve it, despite the opposition.
I am the CEO of a company, and I would hire a guy like your Cadet King to come work for me any day. As for the rest of you, enjoy your freedom of speech that my buddies and I served to protect for over forty years. I just hope that you put as much time as you do posting on here with complaints as you do asserting efforts in pursuit of constructive projects that are going to help your organization and its members.
In the service, you would never do this to one of your own. At the end of the day, you are all on the same team. That is what is offensive from all of this: not his video, but the fact that members like you would chastise to such a degree one of your own.
That's my outside input. I'll leave you all to your "small-minded discussion of people..." rather than "ideas."
Regards,
This is nonsense from a 20 year old, 3rd class ROTC cadet.
The horse died three days ago, quit flogging it!
Entertaining thread lol
I could probably put something thoughtful here, but its all in CAPR 52-16 and CAPP 52-19. Cheers!
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
I served in the military, and I have worked in business. In the business world, there are times when it is cutthroat, and ego is everything. There's nothing wrong with ego. My take on your posts is that each of you feel challenged and that you had your ego attacked. If you say you do not feel that way, well, then you should, because this kid's got something! He reminds me a lot of me and many of my fellow general officers. I think this boys vision is great!
So you served in the Military, and Worked in business, which means you currently do not work in business based on your word choice, so I call you out on being a CEO below. I also seriously doubt you were ever a "General Officer". Most Officers know how to write a response that does not look like yours. You would also not be referring to him as a "kid", or "boy", but Cadet. I call you out.
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
I am the CEO of a company, and I would hire a guy like your Cadet King to come work for me any day.
I own a small business and I would never higher a person like this Cadet should I know of his exploits and controversy on the internet. I would also not higher somebody off the street based only on how "good" I thought he gave a speech that was pieced together. So, I call you out on not being a CEO. More likely you are a friend or family member of the "Chairman".
Quote from: Pendragon on February 01, 2010, 04:56:48 PM
As for the rest of you, enjoy your freedom of speech that my buddies and I served to protect for over forty years.
Who the hell are you to even say something like that. Most that serve or have served would never say something like that in public.
I serve, and although I know my contributions are important to the United States, Freedoms are not provided just by the military. Once again I call you out.
"As for the rest of you, enjoy your freedom of speech that my buddies and I served to protect for over forty years."
Excuse me........ get over your self.....I will enjoy my freedom, thanks to my buddies and family memebers who have served. This is not the place to come insult people who have served, Thats what I get out of your above statement .
Folks, I think this is what are General/CEO is trying to say:
I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a [darn] what you think you are entitled to............
Can we get this thread locked?
Ned is right - my apologies. I made some errors of self-perception myself back in the day.
Anyone else have a horse that needs flogging?
Spike, I think you meant "hire" as to employ; not "higher" as in to lift up or promote.
Just checking.
Quote from: High Speed Low Drag on February 02, 2010, 06:00:29 PM
Ned is right - my apologies. I made some errors of self-perception myself back in the day.
Anyone else have a horse that needs flogging?
What's up with CAPM 39-1? >:D
BTW, what does BTW mean? ??? I have never heard of 39-1.