Online Cadet Promotions Program now available in eServices

[MIKE]

One thing I noticed is that the Achievement is not tied to Grade.

Even if you put in all the achievements to the Mitchell the cadet is still listed as C/Amn not C/2d Lt.

Oversight on the NHQ part???

It makes it easier to demote as necessary? 

Edit: Just from looking at it quickly auto-promote on achievement completion would create some issues.  It needs to be independent of each other for the purposes of demotion or retention in grade IAW CAPR 52-16.

[Camas]

It is tied to OpsQual so when you enter the Curry there it should automatically enter it for OpsQual.

I'd be curious if Nat'l pulls the plug on the OpsQual-Cadet entry, validation and report permissions.  If the new system carries this information over we probably don't really need it anymore except for those units who, for whatever reason (SIMS or paper forms), elect not to use it.

[Tim Medeiros]

One thing I noticed is that the Achievement is not tied to Grade.

Even if you put in all the achievements to the Mitchell the cadet is still listed as C/Amn not C/2d Lt.

Oversight on the NHQ part???

Does anyone know if this is tied to OpsQual so if you enter the Curry here, do you also have to enter it there for a 101 to be valid?

Thats something I brought up in the first round of testing in October.  "The web control which shows the "C/Amn" is something that will need to be updated in the future.  We didn't program that here at National so I will forward this concern on to them.  I can assure you that I am keeping track of the cadet's current rank." was the response

[arajca]

I gave it a try and it works. It took me about five minutes to get comfortable with the format and switching between SIMS and Eservices, but I am averaging 1 - 1.5 minutes per achievement entry - with scores. If I just do approval dates, less than 45 secs. per achievement.

Of course, this was after Eservices was down for a couple hours this afternoon.

[mikeylikey]

With E-Services we can input the info into the system from anywhere, and we don't have to install software.  That is a huge plus.  Remember this is only a start to what NHQ will be automating on-line.  I hope that in 2  years everything that once had to be done by way of paper will be electronic.  That will greatly improve customer service and make our jobs easier. 

The reports feature gives the end user exactly what we need to quickly scan and go regarding where Cadets stand on promotions.  I also liked the Encampment report.  I would like to see a spot added where we can specify what "other activities" Cadets participated in during the month.

[RickFranz]

We use SIMS in our Squadron and it did not take to long to get all the data and then input it to the new system at NHQ.  I made up a very simple spreadsheet that puts all the data in the order they are asking for it.  If anyone would like a copy just let me know.

[Tubacap]

Anybody know if Vandeleren is going to make this information dump down into SIMS via capwatch export?

[brasda91]

since I have tried and tried to get SIMS running on my squadron laptop to no avail, this may be just what I need.

[Tim Medeiros]

Anybody know if Vandeleren is going to make this information dump down into SIMS via capwatch export?

Has anyone noticed if the information is available in the CAPWATCH download?

[captrncap]

I haven't seen a table in CAPWATCH for promotions so I don't think an export would work without the table.

[BlackKnight]

I've been trying to input historical promotion data for my cadets into the new application.  This is done via the administration module.  Came to my first cadet officer on the list, a C/1st Lt.  So I laboriously enter all the data for her, Curry through the Armstrong, plus some editing on her Mitchell scores.  But that's as far as I can go. The system won't let me enter her info for the Flight Commander and Administrative Officer positions.

If I use the regular data entry module to input the officer promotions the approval dates and time-in-grade will be wrong because it insists on using the current date.  So that's not an option.

Finally found this little gem in the Cadet Promotions FAQ:

=====================
Question: I was trying to add an (any achievement higher than Armstrong) in the administration area.  It does not allow me to go past the Armstrong.  How do I enter this achievement?

Answer: NHQ has made the decision that all achievements past the Armstrong will need to be input by a HQ employee. Please contact NHQ to get these achievements entered.
=====================

Lovely.  I have five cadet officers in my unit that need achievement data input past the Mitchell, and now it appears that I will have to contact NHQ during normal M-F working hours and talk them through what I need done for each one.  I guess someone figured neither the DCCs nor the member-services folks at NHQ have enough to do already...

My previous observations that this new application is wasteful of my limited volunteer time compared to SIMS seem to have been validated.   

[captrncap]

I had to do that also. I made a memo to Sharon Jackson and emailed it to her. It was up the next day.

The other thing is once you keep up on entering the data (i.e. Flight Commander), you can enter it your self in the Data Entry module.

[Major Carrales]

I like it.  If, in time, the features that SIMS had (mass entry et al) can be grafted on.  All the better.

Please, don't fight this.  As has been said, this is a long time in coming.  E-services is universal and now cadet records can transfer with a CADET.  No more "confederated" cadet programs.  Cadets awards are now recorded Nationally in e-services and in the member report, rejoice!!!

[BlackKnight]

...Please, don't fight this.  As has been said, this is a long time in coming. 

Major, I'm not "fighting it". I'm pointing out design/programing flaws that are obvious to anyone who takes an objective look.  Such a look cannot be accomplished while sitting atop the bandwagon. To inspect the axle bearings you have to climb down and pull the wheels off. Why do they squeak so? Did someone forget the grease?  As a squadron I/T officer and unit WSA, and an engineer with over 30-years experience from the birth of the IBM PC to the modern day internet and corporate VPNs, I recognize efficient programming when I see it. I have also developed an intolerance for I/T applications that waste about as much user time as they save. I cannot think of a single valid "CAPR 52-16 / Cadet Programs" reason to have locked the DCCs and unit commanders out of the admin module for cadet officers. The FAQ statement thus begs the conclusion that NHQ doesn't trust commanders at the squadron level to input the cadet officer data properly. But if that is the case why are we allowed to enter it for cadet officers in the normal progression (data entry) module?  And is the progression data history for cadet airmen and NCO's somehow less important than for cadet officers, such that NHQ doesn't care if we screw up the Admin data entry for Phase I and II cadets?

The illogic of this makes me want to raise the BS flag. I suspect they hosed up the programing of the admin module for the cadet officers, but instead of fixing it they pushed forward (Microsoft style) to meet a self-imposed deadline to release the application. Then instead of admitting in the FAQ that the admin module still had a bug or two (we all would have understood and respected that- minor problems are normal in new applications), they cooked up a silly "administrative policy" that all Admin changes above the Armstrong had to be entered by one NHQ staffer- identified by name!  And where is the accompanying guidance on what specific information needs to be supplied to NHQ to enter the cadet officer data?  Exactly what info fields are needed? Do they want it in spreadsheet format? MS Notepad?  CAPF-52's?  CAPF-66's?  SIMS exports?

I attended a professional development course a few months ago where a BIG DEAL was made about how the membership should refrain from pestering NHQ staff over minutia.   Frankly, I respect Ms. Jackson's time too much to bug her with this.  I'll just have to wait until they get their act together and hope for significant improvements in Rev 1 of the application.

[mikeylikey]

^ Or do Officer Promotions the same way we have been....by means of paper and fax.  If they want to waste their time at NHQ inputing data for us, so be it.  When a Cadet reaches the Mitch, I will just stop with e-services at that point and start filling the forms out!

[ADCAPer]

Please, don't fight this. 

Yeah! What's your problem man?  Have you forgotten that you're just a lowly volunteer, so you can't possibly know anything and anything! And besides, the people who really know how to run things (you know, National) don't have the time to be bothered with complaints about a product that they created that only causes more problems and waste more of the free time that you obviously were going to give to CAP in the first place!   

And BlackKnight, I know that you know I'm kidding, hopefully everyone else will too.

[afgeo4]

One thing I noticed is that the Achievement is not tied to Grade.

Even if you put in all the achievements to the Mitchell the cadet is still listed as C/Amn not C/2d Lt.

Oversight on the NHQ part???

Does anyone know if this is tied to OpsQual so if you enter the Curry here, do you also have to enter it there for a 101 to be valid?

Maybe achievement is finished when all requirements are met, but grade is assigned when the cadet is actually promoted? A cadet can be held from promotion due to many things, even if he/she passes all the requirements.

[ctrossen]

If I use the regular data entry module to input the officer promotions the approval dates and time-in-grade will be wrong because it insists on using the current date.  So that's not an option.

Okay, just to be clear, if my DCOC (or whoever is assigned to do so) doesn't get the information entered immediately, and/or I (or whoever I provide the appropriate permissions to) don't get into the system right away to approve, the cadet's online records are going to be incorrect, with no way to change (save have the NHQ staff go in and manually fix it)?

You know, the idea of being able to pull certain historical reports is nice, but I think I'll stick with paper. I like being able to look at the chart on the wall, or pull the binder with our cadet master records.

[Tim Medeiros]

not right away, you can back date information in the data-entry module, its just generally easier using the administration module which is actually best for entering old information quickly

[Major Carrales]

So, where do we begin.

1) E-services in CAP has been fragmented since the start.  SIMS, WMU, local items, e-services proper and development in different eras.  (SIMS...hummm, no one from National or Wing ever really explained that to South Texas.)

2) No one single Electronic Location from which to draw

3) Failure of the general membership to "get on board" with an electronic CAP.

4) People dedicated to "their" way of going things that negates any new ideas.

It seems to be that the following needs to happen...

1) Total revamping of CAP REGS, FORMS and PAMPLETS to "iron out" inconsistencies

2) Totally redesigned e-services to conform to those regs allowing fluid movement between cadet and CAP Officer issues including spec track, operations and promotions.

3) 100% computer access to all CAP members and 100% training for them all!


Not very viable is it.  Until then, what would you have use do?  We go with what exists and don't long for speculative "better ways."