Draft 52-18 (Cadet Physical Fitness Program) Posted

[Ned]

Greetings,

We have posted the first draft of the new CAPP 52-18 on the Cadet Proving Grounds page of the NHQ CP webpage.  You will also be able to review the cover letter which contains our timetable for the review, revisions, and roll out of the new program.

I invite all cadets and others interested in cadet programs to review the materials and let us know what you think.  The best place to post feedback is on the The Cadet Blog and through your chain of command.  I'll be watching here, of course, but it's best to put the feedback where the staffers and officers responsible for revisions can easily see it.

Any significant change in our terrific cadet program should be reviewed carefully before implementation.  We remain committed to transparency as we develop the program.  We will carefully consider comments and suggestions, and we are also committed to extensive field testing of the program to ensure that it is both comprehensive and easy for units to administer.

Feel free to engage in discussions, but I may not be able to respond to all questions and concerns as quickly as you may like.

Ned Lee
Col, CAP
National Cadet Program Manager

[Shutterbug]

After initially reading through this draft, I would like to say that these are certainly some drastic changes, and feathers will be ruffled once this gains more exposure among the CAP inter-webs.

I applaud the efforts to overhaul the Cadet Physical Fitness Program as a whole. Areas that haven't received much attention in the past are now getting the face lift they deserve. I was not surprised to see our CPFT standards evolve into what some might refer to as "watered down", and it was fascinating to see how most got easier while some became more difficult.

For example, the jump from the cadet achievement mile times to the Spaatz mile times is a tad drastic, but in the end it gives cadets something to strive for if they intend to earn their triple diamonds someday, instead of just scraping by on the bare minimums up to the Eaker.

In just about every CPFT I've taken, I've tried to push myself and go above and beyond the bare minimums, and have encouraged my cadets to do the same. I see these standards as a adequate guidelines, and as long as we keep encouraging our cadets to strive for excellence in all they do, things will work out just fine.

There's more to the Cadet Physical Fitness Program than just "taking the test", and this draft showcases that well. I look forward to seeing what the future holds.

[abdsp51]

Col Lee.  After looking at it what was the driving force behind changing the curl ups from a timed measurement to a cadence measurement?  Also I have noticed that the "form" has changed on it.  Is this something that has been determined as safer or easier? 

I am all for incorporating more PT type stuff but looking at seems like its been made easier to pass. Is this part of the intent?

[TheSkyHornet]

Col Lee.  After looking at it what was the driving force behind changing the curl ups from a timed measurement to a cadence measurement?  Also I have noticed that the "form" has changed on it.  Is this something that has been determined as safer or easier? 

I am all for incorporating more PT type stuff but looking at seems like its been made easier to pass. Is this part of the intent?

I have to agree. I favor the timed measurement as opposed to the cadence, and most cadets that I know seem to prefer it to be timed. So I'm wondering why push-ups went from timed to cadence in the old format, and now curl-ups in this draft.

[abdsp51]

Col Lee.  After looking at it what was the driving force behind changing the curl ups from a timed measurement to a cadence measurement?  Also I have noticed that the "form" has changed on it.  Is this something that has been determined as safer or easier? 

I am all for incorporating more PT type stuff but looking at seems like its been made easier to pass. Is this part of the intent?

I have to agree. I favor the timed measurement as opposed to the cadence, and most cadets that I know seem to prefer it to be timed. So I'm wondering why push-ups went from timed to cadence in the old format, and now curl-ups in this draft.

Since I have been back (2012) push-ups was always cadence based.  When I was a cadet it was all timed, push ups, sit ups, and the run.  The only thing not timed was the sit and reach. 

[LSThiker]

Col Lee.  After looking at it what was the driving force behind changing the curl ups from a timed measurement to a cadence measurement?  Also I have noticed that the "form" has changed on it.  Is this something that has been determined as safer or easier? 

I am all for incorporating more PT type stuff but looking at seems like its been made easier to pass. Is this part of the intent?

I have to agree. I favor the timed measurement as opposed to the cadence, and most cadets that I know seem to prefer it to be timed. So I'm wondering why push-ups went from timed to cadence in the old format, and now curl-ups in this draft.

Since I have been back (2012) push-ups was always cadence based.  When I was a cadet it was all timed, push ups, sit ups, and the run.  The only thing not timed was the sit and reach.

When push-ups were introduced in 2004, they were cadence. At no point were they timed except by those units doing it incorrectly.

[abdsp51]

Col Lee.  After looking at it what was the driving force behind changing the curl ups from a timed measurement to a cadence measurement?  Also I have noticed that the "form" has changed on it.  Is this something that has been determined as safer or easier? 

I am all for incorporating more PT type stuff but looking at seems like its been made easier to pass. Is this part of the intent?

I have to agree. I favor the timed measurement as opposed to the cadence, and most cadets that I know seem to prefer it to be timed. So I'm wondering why push-ups went from timed to cadence in the old format, and now curl-ups in this draft.

Since I have been back (2012) push-ups was always cadence based.  When I was a cadet it was all timed, push ups, sit ups, and the run.  The only thing not timed was the sit and reach.

When push-ups were introduced in 2004, they were cadence. At no point were they timed except by those units doing it incorrectly.

Push ups were introduced as a timed event the same as sit-up's 96/97.  I was a cadet then and had to take the new PT test to promote to C/2d LT.  Prior to that the only pt requirement for cadets to promote was a mile run.

[LSThiker]

Sorry I was only referring to the introduction post-2004.

[NIN]

IIRC, the cadence-based pushups was a thing from the Presidential Physical Fitness program (or whatever name the program was going by at the time/now).  Since much of the CPFT was based on that program, the cadence-based exercises were a carry-thru.

Honestly, I'm not a fan, but I administer the test as prescribed. 

[vesryn]

These changes look quite drastic, and it will be interesting to see them implemented in a small squadron such as mine. It'll certainly help with not having to do mile runs in the freezing winter. Congrats to the drafters of this new CPFT, there are some great ideas. The six month HFZ seems a lot like what I've heard from my JROTC friend about their fitness testing. This testing is also a lot like current military testing (from what I've heard). I (as a cadet) approve, but I'll have to really read more in depth into this to give some solid conclusions about it.

Also a minor spelling error(?) that has probably already been caught - Appendix A, One Mile Run, Scoring : 

"The object of the test for these younger students is simply to complete the one-mile distance at a comfortable pace and to prac-tice pacing, so it is not necessary to time the run for these students."

[Ned]

Thanks for the feedback so far, please keep it up!

Col Lee.  After looking at it what was the driving force behind changing the curl ups from a timed measurement to a cadence measurement?  Also I have noticed that the "form" has changed on it.  Is this something that has been determined as safer or easier? 

I am all for incorporating more PT type stuff but looking at seems like its been made easier to pass. Is this part of the intent?

The "mechanics" of the events are taken directly from the extensively-researched Presidential Youth Fitness Program (PYFP).  One of the major objectives of the draft CPFT revision is to ensure that it is based on the science of youth fitness and health assessment, rather than subjective standards of how many pushups or curl ups a given cadet "should" be able to do based on their age, gender, and CAP grade.

And part of that is basing our standards on the documented results of thousands of assessments administered to millions of young people in the CAP cadet age-group.  Not old standards and test from decades before videogames, mobile devices, and ubiquitous fast food, but real measurements of middle and high school students today.  Accordingly we need to run the tests the same way that the PYFP folks do to make sure we are comparing "apples to apples," so to speak.  They use the cadenced assessments for push-ups and curl-ups, so we have to do so.

I have not spoken with the right people at the PYFP to be able to say exactly why their curl-up assessment changed from timed to cadenced with slightly different mechanics, but I think we can safely assume they changed based on input from physiologists and physicians to reduce the possibility of sports injuries during the exam.  I'll see if I can find some specifics.

[lordmonar]

Stop using science!!!!

[SARDOC]

if they are running the Presidential Youth Fitness program at their school, can we accept the results for our purposes?

[Ned]

if they are running the Presidential Youth Fitness program at their school, can we accept the results for our purposes?

Remembering that the assessment is only one part of the Physical Fitness Program, the answer is "yes" subject to the discretion of the commander.  See paragraph 5-11 of the draft.

[ranger0305]

I would like to know why they changed the form of the curl-ups. I don't like the changing from a timed exercise to cadence but it doesn't matter too much, but the new form seems slightly ridiculous to me. Also the mile run i just had to get an 8:08 to pass, now all i would have to do is about 10:00? That wouldn't even be trying to me, PT is supposed to be a challenge. I understand that cadets fitness isn't what it used to be but the higher ranks should challenge you, now the fastest run time would be 8:04, and 7:35 for fitness badge.
The one thing i agree with is giving cadets in their first phase rank without a test, as i have lost a few cadets who were active and interested but couldn't pass PT.

Of course please remember this is my personal opinion.

Respectfully,
Ranger.

[LSThiker]

61 push-ups for the Spaatz?  That is going to get a lot of cadets. 

Keep up the good work, Ned.

[almostspaatz]

Stop using science!!!!

IKR, right? Why won't they just do whatever WE want...instead of asking all those experts and stuff.....

[lordmonar]

PT is supposed to be a challenge. I understand that cadets fitness isn't what it used to be but the higher ranks should challenge you

Why?   What does being a faster runner, able to do more push ups or curl ups have to do with being a better leader?

That was one of the problems with the current system.    The higher percentiles for higher ranks was an arbitrary standard.    Being in good physical health is important in a good leader, but there is no correlation (as far as I have heard) between being in "better' physical shape and leadership ability. 

Even on active duty there are no extra points for being in better shape then the minimums.   They do give out awards and rewards for doing better....but they do not directly relate to your promote-ability.   

To Ned and the CP folks.....this looks very good.   

I was wondering why we are keeping the 2+Run standard and not changing back to a 3+Run.   I think this sends a mixed message about being well rounded and balanced in your fitness.

I also see an issue with the quarterly testing cycle.   Right now if a cadet fails a test he/hes can retest in four weeks.....with the new system they must wait for the next quarter(or more if they can't make the next Saturday testing session).    I think we need to make sure that we include language that leaves it open for units to perform tests out of cycle if they choose to do so.

[arajca]

IRT the 2+run, I have had several cadets with long legs who could not pass the sit-&-reach. These cadet were typically bean-poles with very little fat. Their physiology made it impossible for them to pass. We made them attempt it, of course, but no one expected them to pass. Should they have been denied promotion because they were physically incapable of meeting the standard? Or should they been put in a CPFT Category III status?

[Garibaldi]

IRT the 2+run, I have had several cadets with long legs who could not pass the sit-&-reach. These cadet were typically bean-poles with very little fat. Their physiology made it impossible for them to pass. We made them attempt it, of course, but no one expected them to pass. Should they have been denied promotion because they were physically incapable of meeting the standard? Or should they been put in a CPFT Category III status?

Were they able to pass the Sit and Reach and Push Ups, in addition to the mile (or shuttle run)?