CAP members to get Army awards

[Johnny Yuma]

I gotta shout RESPECT! to all of IAWG for this award. I also know Nick Critelli's put a boatload of work into this himself and deserves kudos as well.

The only black eye to all this is Pineda's presence. He only shows up when it makes him look good, a la Katrina and he's created enough grief in NCR recently.

[DNall]

I'm not concerned with the wear policy in talking about the issue, but rather the status of the award as a spring board from which to seek broader recognition by the AF (and NG in this case) for our services - which has little to do with awards & lots to do with integration - AND, as a spring board to revising the Iowa model to a nationally adoptable system - such as under 1AF in the scenerio I mentioned. None of this has squat to do with if these very deserving individuals can or can't wear Army civil service/civilian decorations on CAP uniforms, I could care less to be honest.

I've heard you mention the idea of using 1AF as a horse to help derive similar benefits as the Iowa Model.  1AF has next to no active relationships with the States.  Their relationships with the State EMA / HLS agencies is pretty non-existent (at least as far as I've noticed).   The State EMA / HLS agencies are the ones with additional missions for us to do, not 1AF.

The reason that partnering with the National Guard (Air and Army) in Iowa was because they are plugged in to the State infrastructure and political scene.   1AF has no additional funds to throw CAP's way, but each state may.  The National Guard has state missions that we have a stake in and have a high probability of participating in.  These state missions are the secret to Iowa's success.  The National Guard is not necessarily generating all the missions Iowa is doing, but they have helped to improve the relationship with Iowa HLSEM so that CAP is thought of for more and more missions.  1AF... not so much.

For example I was involved in an Air Defense mission.   The event occured over the airspace of our state and the state authorities and National Guard had no clue that it was even happening.  Not a great way for 1AF to foster positive relationships with the State authorities.

Anyway, I respectfully disagree about riding on 1AF to do much good for the CAP Wings locally.   However, I'd gladly take whatever missions they want to throw our way whenever those infrequently occur.

I understand, and certainly I'm not describing it as a silver bullet to solve all our problems. The issue I have with that characterization of the guard is that it isn't necessary. CAP can plug in equally well in direct partnership w/ state EMA & none of the help or money Iowa is getting. As I've mentioned, Texas is not all that far from such a situaiton now & that's a relationship that has existed for a very long time. The reason it isn't closer is they have tons of similiar resources & don't need us to the extent a state like Iowa has.

Personally, I believe the great benefit to CAP in the Iowa example is not so much the missions produced, but the reorganization & professionalization of the force w/ the help of the guard on their model. I realize the motivation to go down that road was more missions (being relavent) and the change in CAP there makes them more useful to all parties, not just the state. If you stick strctly to the NG as in the Iowa model, it just doesn't work in most states. If it would have then we would have been moved to the NGB as was considered in depth by Air Staff.

I do feel 1AF in conjunction w/ the NGB are a good basis for such a CAP reorganization on a national scale. I don't care so much about the missions. They come to a qualified force in the right place at the right time w/ the right tools. I'm not sure how the technicalities have worked in Iowa to date, but I imagine when they want to deploy CAP on a mission that they do call AFRCC to make the request so AF will pay the bill versus the state, and AFRCC works for 1AF. Wuld it be better if 1AF was better plugged in w/ state EMA/HLS networks & the AGs, for sure, but that's well above my paygrade. All I can say is CAP might be appealing to 1AF as a little lubricant in bridging some of that gap, in that doing this w/ CAP builds those coordination relationships. I think it's definately something worth exploring by all parties.

There's pros & cons to what's going on in Iowa. I like 90% of it & am highly hopeful it'll be the catlyst to change across CAP. However, it can be copied almost no where: for the logistis/funding/size issues for starters; but also, because the need just isn't there in many places & the route taken to get there isn't the most efficient. There is a way to learn from this unique situaiton & carry its lessons to a national scale, but it means making some changes along the way. Respectfully.

[RiverAux]

Although the money IA Wing is getting from the state is nice, it isn't all that unusual.  The most important thing I think they're getting from the Guard is the logistical support that allows them to put 100 members up over night and feed them one weekend a month. 

There are other commercial and even non-profit venues where that sort of thing could be put on but the Wing would have to pay good $ for it. 

[Nick Critelli]

Yuma

I disagree with your comments about Gen. Pineda. He came  at our invitation. It was extremely important that we have  the National Commander in attendance.  It was an affirmance that all of CAP is on board with what we have done.  It confirmed that CAP can bring much more in terms of assets than that which are stationed in Iowa.  But more importantly, it provided an opportunity for The Adjutant General to colloborate with our National Commander. As a result of the colloboration, we will be briefing the TAG's of all 50 states at their Februray meeting with a goal of introducing the opportunities CAP can bring to them. Many don't know about us or of our benefits. 

Regardless of what you think about the National Commander you must give him this: He went out of his way to come here.  All weekend he was at a region conference and flew here immediately afterwards.  He  spent three days here which meant he hadn't been home in a week. He came through for us when asked.

[flyguy06]

Please show me where you see this ribbon? I cant find it.

         
http://www.army.mil/soldiers/jan1998/ribbons/ribbonsleft1.html

[Pylon]

Please show me where you see this ribbon? I cant find it.

         
http://www.army.mil/soldiers/jan1998/ribbons/ribbonsleft1.html

It's because those in the chart you posted are only Department of the Army awards for military personnel.  The aforementioned awards are a Department of the Army award for civilian service.

[flyguy06]

Ohhhhhhhhh. Didnt know there was such a thing. TRhanks for clearing that up for me.

[DNall]

Sure, there's a whole series of awards from each service & the DoD for civil service employees. Under some circumstances those are given to private citizens, just like under some circumstances certain military decorations are also awarded to civilians.

[arajca]

Here's the Army Civilian awards Department of the Army Civilian Medals and Decorations

The Commander's Award for Public Service is here.

[flyguy06]

On what kind of clothing would a civilian wear these medals?

[lordmonar]

A buisness suit, or formal tuxido.

[flyguy06]

Yuma

I disagree with your comments about Gen. Pineda. He came  at our invitation. It was extremely important that we have  the National Commander in attendance.  It was an affirmance that all of CAP is on board with what we have done.  It confirmed that CAP can bring much more in terms of assets than that which are stationed in Iowa.  But more importantly, it provided an opportunity for The Adjutant General to colloborate with our National Commander. As a result of the colloboration, we will be briefing the TAG's of all 50 states at their Februray meeting with a goal of introducing the opportunities CAP can bring to them. Many don't know about us or of our benefits. 

Regardless of what you think about the National Commander you must give him this: He went out of his way to come here.  All weekend he was at a region conference and flew here immediately afterwards.  He  spent three days here which meant he hadn't been home in a week. He came through for us when asked.

Just out of curiosity, how does the National Commander find time to do al this volunteering and travelling around the country? What about his civilian job? I could never get that much time off from my job.

[RogueLeader]

Yuma

I disagree with your comments about Gen. Pineda. He came  at our invitation. It was extremely important that we have  the National Commander in attendance.  It was an affirmance that all of CAP is on board with what we have done.  It confirmed that CAP can bring much more in terms of assets than that which are stationed in Iowa.  But more importantly, it provided an opportunity for The Adjutant General to colloborate with our National Commander. As a result of the colloboration, we will be briefing the TAG's of all 50 states at their Februray meeting with a goal of introducing the opportunities CAP can bring to them. Many don't know about us or of our benefits. 

Regardless of what you think about the National Commander you must give him this: He went out of his way to come here.  All weekend he was at a region conference and flew here immediately afterwards.  He  spent three days here which meant he hadn't been home in a week. He came through for us when asked.

As you say that he came at your request, but do you think that it possible that some was pure politics. 

[RogueLeader]

Just out of curiosity, how does the National Commander find time to do al this volunteering and travelling around the country? What about his civilian job? I could never get that much time off from my job.
[/quote]

I would like to know what job he has in the civ sector.  I would like to get that kind of time off too, was well as the money to do it.

[BillB]

Having worked with MGen Pineda prior to his becoming National Commander, I think many are misjudging his goals for CAP. Granted he has to play the petty politics of the corporate structure, but his aims are to improve CAP as an organization. His state job in Florida allows a flex schedule so he can put the required time in for CAP and still complete the job in Florida.

[cyclone]

Maj Gen Pineda survived a grueling schedule while in Iowa.  We had him out the door at 7 am and back at his room at 11 pm for the three days he was here (which was after 3 days at a conference out east).  He wanted to see what CAP was doing, not just at the high level, but every level.

He commented that he would like to visit a squadron meeting, but unfortunately none of our squadrons in the area met on the evenings he was in town.

I think it wisest for us not to worry about how he can spend this much time helping CAP, but how your wings could lobby the state legislatures to protect your jobs while you are doing CAP.

[DNall]

Having worked with MGen Pineda prior to his becoming National Commander, I think many are misjudging his goals for CAP. Granted he has to play the petty politics of the corporate structure, but his aims are to improve CAP as an organization. His state job in Florida allows a flex schedule so he can put the required time in for CAP and still complete the job in Florida.

Which is all fine, and trust me when I say I want to give him the benefit of the doubt, but he has to COMMUNICATE!!!! I think he would find if he played straight with people in the field & pulled no punches that he might just fund overwhelming grassroots support, and with that support he can freely tell the NB to stick it & get on with making a force that the members & AF approve of.

[Steve Kuddes]

So MG Pineda thought it was great enough to brief all of the Wing Commanders by conference call.  Anybody know what happened on that conference call?  Do you know who asked a lot of questions and who was rudely told to "shut up" by MG Pineda?
The questions concerned the membership drop of 17% since IAWG started this program.  Do you know how many squadrons have folded and how many members have left CAP or transferred to other Wings?
Before we accept this program as the "cure all" for CAP, we need all of the facts.  How many officers and squadrons did they have at the beginning of the year and how many do they have now?
How about it Lt Colonel Critelli?

[DNall]

Can you call yourself "Spy" and post in a conspiratorial tone? Is that really allowed?

I can't quote you statistics on Iowa, but let me help you understand the situation. CAP now has ~53k members on the books. However, as best as we can determine less than half of those are active & that rate has been consistent for longer than Gen Pineda has been around. The percentages inside that number tend to favor higher cadet participation than senior. If you took an honest look at our membership numbers, you'd find a very different picture. Now if you recall, Iowa moved inactive members out of local units to a reserve status in the Wg holding unit. That left numbers on the books at local units that were actually accurate reflections of what was going on at the ground level. If you look at that honest assessment & see a unit that's had 3-5 adults & 10 kids for the past 15 years, do you need to keep them as a Sq? Is it fair to ask them to complete the work load expected of 20-30 adults & 40-50 kids? Is putting that operations load on them cause them to spend so much time & effort to create a minimum standard performance on paper that they are not able to do justice to the programs in reality & hence snowball teh retention problem? In reality, that's the case with I'd say 90-95% of CAP Sqs in the country. It's completely unfair & inaccurate to judge performance by MML or unit numbers. In point of fact, any serious effort to fix the situation & make CAP strong would begin with getting & operating on accurate metrics.

In short, it seems like you're questioning the validity of what iowa is doing on teh basis of inaccurate to the point of being meaningless numbers, and it wouldn't suprise me at all if Wg CCs did the same cause that's teh best metrics they have to work with.

[RiverAux]

I can't speak to membership numbers, but I do have capwatch downloads for the past year.  They indicate that as of November 30, 2005 Iowa Wing had 1 HQ unit, 1 "ghost/reserve" squadron, 1 legislative squadron, 9 squadrons, and 2 flights.  As of November 30, 2006 all those units except the 2 flights are still in existence. 

I assume the flights were disestablished as separate units and redesignated as "bases" under the Iowa plan.