My BBDU experiment: after two years, I be done with this nonsense

[spaatzmom]

They've all been asked and answered 100 times.

Khaki, gray, blue, whatever.  Wasted breath.

:clap: :clap: :clap:

And that just reinforces my belief that the "haves" are quite happy with relegating the "have nots" to second-class status and will resist any effort to change their privileged status.

.

Lol you think I am a "have".   That is so off the mark and hilarious. I just don't believe in the so called 2nd class status bs that some wish to promulgate.  I am just tired of hearing the same thing being beaten to death year after year.  I don't need to lighten up about this non issue.  Why am I not entitled to my opinion but you are?  I would much rather see people really investing themselves and their time in matters that actually are important.  Debating uniforms ad nauseam is not conducive to positive job performance.   What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

[Panache]

Yet the problem is still outstanding.  So, we just give up?

No, we work it through the proper channels.

And I'm fine with that.  Except (1) "proper channels" doesn't seem the care, because the higher-ups don't seem compelled to follow the same rules they set that everybody else is expected to follow, and (2) I never got the impression that CAPTalk was "proper channels".  If you're going to shut down the discussion based on that rational, shouldn't 90% (if not more!) of what it talked about here in this forum also be curtailed as well?

That said, while resolving the diversity/disparity of uniforms is important, there are more pressing issues in CAP. Those relating to membership/manning levels, training, equipment and mission accomplishment/relevance come to mind.

And I don't dispute that one bit.  But, along those lines, it shouldn't be something that's just "swept under the rug" because it makes some people uncomfortable.

"Haves?"

Probably those that can wear the AF style who are compliant with H/W and grooming willfully.

Correct.  Thank you, abdsp51.

Why am I not entitled to my opinion but you are?

Please point out where I said you were not allowed to have an opinion on the matter.

Actually, what riled my feathers was you telling shuman14 that he wasn't entitled to one, remember?

Debating uniforms ad nauseam is not conducive to positive job performance.

With all due respect, ma'am, nobody is forcing you to read this thread.  If you find this particular discussion without merit, just ignore it and move on.

What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

The folks who work in the multi-billion dollar fashion and clothing industry would probably say "both".

[Shuman 14]

What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

So you're saying CAP, as an organization, is incapable of doing both at the same time? 

[spaatzmom]

Quote from: spaatzmom on Today at 03:03:24 AM
Why am I not entitled to my opinion but you are?

Please point out where I said you were not allowed to have an opinion on the matter.

Actually, what riled my feathers was you telling shuman14 that he wasn't entitled to one, remember?

I never said he was not entitled to his opinion just questioned his true motive.

Quote from: spaatzmom on Today at 03:03:24 AM
Debating uniforms ad nauseam is not conducive to positive job performance.

With all due respect, ma'am, nobody is forcing you to read this thread.  If you find this particular discussion without merit, just ignore it and move on.

So you are telling to shut up and sit down.  Well that's not going to happen.  I don't post that often but I do fully believe in what I do post and no one including you will stop that. 

Quote from: spaatzmom on Today at 03:03:24 AM
What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

The folks who work in the multi-billion dollar fashion and clothing industry would probably say "both".

So looking good trumps performance.  Nice to know where you really stand.

[spaatzmom]

What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

So you're saying CAP, as an organization, is incapable of doing both at the same time? 

Not at all.  I just don't believe that CAP as a whole does not look like the trashy bunch of hicks that you imply.  In general, most members wear their uniform properly with pride and look good.  But I think that job performance far outweighs the clothing that is worn.  If someone I know is lost and waiting to be found, I personally don't care if they are wearing bunny slippers and Dr. Denton's as long as the person was found.  That gives a much better community impression and continuing cooperation than the clothing worn.  It is all about priorities.  Mine obviously does not match yours.

[Storm Chaser]

Maybe we should add a khaki uniform combination (in addition to the ones we already have) so that when he finally becomes active (if he ever does), he'll have something to wear that he actually likes. 

Sorry, couldn't help myself...

[Shuman 14]

What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

So you're saying CAP, as an organization, is incapable of doing both at the same time? 

Not at all.  I just don't believe that CAP as a whole does not look like the trashy bunch of hicks that you imply.  In general, most members wear their uniform properly with pride and look good.  But I think that job performance far outweighs the clothing that is worn.  If someone I know is lost and waiting to be found, I personally don't care if they are wearing bunny slippers and Dr. Denton's as long as the person was found.  That gives a much better community impression and continuing cooperation than the clothing worn.  It is all about priorities.  Mine obviously does not match yours.

Way to put words into my mouth... the only "trashy" thing  said is by you. You've attacked me, you've called me unworthy and a troll, you've tried to belittle my opinion but guess what... my opinion is just a valid as yours. All opinions are equal on an open unofficial forum like CAPTalk.

Have you ever heard the saying you never get a second chance to make a first impression?

Well I got news for you... your uniform is your first impression.

In any of my post have I ever said that CAP doesn't do a good job, or that CAP members are unprofessional? Guess what, I haven't nor would I ever say that.

That being said, is the uniform issue number one on the white board? No.

-BUT-

In an organization as large as CAP, with an issue that is in the top 10-15 issues, is it impossible, unreasonable, heretical, to suggest that a committee, board, working group be formed to address it?

Is it also  impossible, unreasonable, heretical for people to discuss the said issue on an unofficial forum? I think not.

[Shuman 14]

Maybe we should add a khaki uniform combination (in addition to the ones we already have) so that when he finally becomes active (if he ever does), he'll have something to wear that he actually likes. 

Sorry, couldn't help myself...

And I'll look SOOO pretty in it. 'Cause I'm a dashing young man.

[a2capt]

"on the Laptop... trolling is my Business... and business is good." 

... You've attacked me, you've called me unworthy and a troll, ...

Hoookay.

[Shuman 14]

"on the Laptop... trolling is my Business... and business is good." 

... You've attacked me, you've called me unworthy and a troll, ...

Hoookay.

Yes, hookay. I tried to joke it off the first time, she's borderline personal attacks now, so yes trashy is the word for her comments.

[Panache]

With all due respect, ma'am, nobody is forcing you to read this thread.  If you find this particular discussion without merit, just ignore it and move on.

So you are telling to shut up and sit down.  Well that's not going to happen.  I don't post that often but I do fully believe in what I do post and no one including you will stop that.

Please don't put words in my mouth that I never said.  I never even hinted that you should "sit down and shut up", and frankly find it offensive that you would imply that I did.

What is really more important  looking good on the job or getting the job done and having a positive relationship with the powers that be both in and out of CAP?

The folks who work in the multi-billion dollar fashion and clothing industry would probably say "both".

So looking good trumps performance.  Nice to know where you really stand.

I'm sorry, I'm trying to figure out how my reply of "both" somehow was interpreted as "looking good trump performance".  If you could walk me through that chain of logic, I would appreciate it.

I'm far more comfortable and productive in shorts, t-shirt, and flip-flops at my job, but I'm pretty sure my managers would turn several shades of red if I decided to wear that instead of my usual shirt-and-tie business attire.

[Panache]

"on the Laptop... trolling is my Business... and business is good." 

... You've attacked me, you've called me unworthy and a troll, ...

Hoookay.

Yes, hookay. I tried to joke it off the first time, she's borderline personal attacks now, so yes trashy is the word for her comments.

Well, you do sometimes take part in troll-esque behavior (like trying to bait me in the entire CAP-Officers-Should-Have-Degrees thread).

[Shuman 14]

"on the Laptop... trolling is my Business... and business is good." 

... You've attacked me, you've called me unworthy and a troll, ...

Hoookay.

Yes, hookay. I tried to joke it off the first time, she's borderline personal attacks now, so yes trashy is the word for her comments.

Well, you do sometimes take part in troll-esque behavior (like trying to bait me in the entire CAP-Officers-Should-Have-Degrees thread).

Was I baiting or trying to lead the course of the discussion?

If I offended you, I apologize, it was not my intent.

[Panache]

If I offended you, I apologize, it was not my intent.

No offence taken.

[The CyBorg is destroyed]

I personally do not believe, no matter how much some of us may wish it otherwise, that there is going to be any significant deviation from the multiforms (© Eclipse) we have.

To me, it is a flip-of-a-coin as to whether or not we get ABU's.

The USAF is not going to change its H/W regulations for CAP.

The powers-that-be who design/control the "corporate" uniforms are not going to allow anything but the grey/white, despite allowing blue for field uniforms and flying clothing.

Those who want us completely out of AF uniforms are not going to get their way.

As I see it, it is a choice of:

Wearing it and hating it
Wearing it and liking it
Wearing it and being indifferent about it

I really doubt any change beyond perhaps standardising on cut and colour of the G/W is going to happen.

[Shuman 14]

The powers-that-be who design/control the "corporate" uniforms are not going to allow anything but the grey/white, despite allowing blue for field uniforms and flying clothing.

And I guess this is where not being an active member I don't "get it"... who are these people?

Who appoints and/or elects them?

It seems to me that if those in CAP who are unhappy with the uniform situation can effect the appointments/elections of these power-that-be then you might be able to get some more openminded people into these positions and do something (anything) about it.

[Storm Chaser]

@ shuman14

This is not an attack. Personally, I appreciate your financial contribution to CAP as a patron member and your service to this country through the military reserves.

I believe the reason many here on this board have been "targeting" you is not just because of your opinions (which you're entitled to), but your topics of discussion and the way you come across sometimes.

I went back to review your posts for the last month or so and the vast majority of them were related to the CAP uniform in one way or another. Many were also related to the new NCO program and a few more to requiring degrees in CAP. All of these, as you know, can be controversial topics here in CAP Talk.

What I really found interesting was that I didn't see posts discussing emergency services or operations in CAP. Neither did I find cadet programs or aerospace education or safety discussions on your part. It almost seems that you're fixated on the CAP uniform; not so much learning about it, but figuring a way to change it. The thing is you don't even wear one.

I believe that's the main reason you're received here by many the way you are.

[whatevah]

Thread is locked due to apparent trolling.