ABU's???

[RADIOMAN015]

Personally, performing the assigned missions satisfactorily are more important to me than ANY uniform.

Then why are you always harping on the AF style uniform and demeaning those who wear it?

That's a strong term.   Surely some adults do like to play army (without actually joining the military) and joining CAP does give them that option of wearing AF style military uniforms.   I find that the vast majority are dedicated volunteers and are good people.  Unfortunately, there's a very small minority that somehow believe they are in the military and where possible take advantage of the general public's stupidity to not be able to differentiate the real military member and a CAP member.   I sometimes do get a good laugh at some of the adults wearing AF style uniforms, BUT hey I'm easy to entertain :angel:
RM

[davidsinn]

Personally, performing the assigned missions satisfactorily are more important to me than ANY uniform.

Then why are you always harping on the AF style uniform and demeaning those who wear it?

That's a strong term.   Surely some adults do like to play army (without actually joining the military) and joining CAP does give them that option of wearing AF style military uniforms.   I find that the vast majority are dedicated volunteers and are good people.  Unfortunately, there's a very small minority that somehow believe they are in the military and where possible take advantage of the general public's stupidity to not be able to differentiate the real military member and a CAP member.   I sometimes do get a good laugh at some of the adults wearing AF style uniforms, BUT hey I'm easy to entertain :angel:
RM

Frankly it's very dubious those adults that are wearing their CAP uniforms (especially the AF type uniforms), really have an interest in representing Civil Air Patrol, but instead our trolling for special favors due to confusion by airline personnel.

Your words.

[Stonewall]

ABS-Gs are the way to go.

For USAF or CAP?

They are very expensive because they're fire resistant, but if they made a pair without that feature, they would be perfect.  ABU pattern is perfect for CAP, you can see it from long distances even in thick brush.  I would vote for ABS-Gs for CAP if the price was reasonable.

[titanII]

ABU pattern is perfect for CAP, you can see it from long distances even in thick brush.

[AngelWings]

ABS-Gs are the way to go.

For USAF or CAP?

They are very expensive because they're fire resistant, but if they made a pair without that feature, they would be perfect.  ABU pattern is perfect for CAP, you can see it from long distances even in thick brush.  I would vote for ABS-Gs for CAP if the price was reasonable.

Definately. The ABU doesn't blend into much, so it fits our bill,.

[Grumpy]

The USAF requirement for all servicemembers to be in ABU's is Novemberish/ End of Third Fiscal Quarter. After that date, it'll take a minimum of a year to start an official phase-in of ABU's, but that is in a best of case situation.

The USAF requirement is September 30, 2011.  The AF has said in the past that when they have all of their people in the ABU that CAP would then be allowed to wear it.
From what I have heard/seen, the only stumbling block right now is how "our" insignia will differ from the USAF.
We still have to figure out what we want and then we have to get it approved by the AF.
But the AF has said in the past that they want us in the ABU.

Why not just keep the same blue and white tapes we've always had?  Every time we turn around SOMEBODY wants to reinvent the horse.

[davidsinn]

The USAF requirement for all servicemembers to be in ABU's is Novemberish/ End of Third Fiscal Quarter. After that date, it'll take a minimum of a year to start an official phase-in of ABU's, but that is in a best of case situation.

The USAF requirement is September 30, 2011.  The AF has said in the past that when they have all of their people in the ABU that CAP would then be allowed to wear it.
From what I have heard/seen, the only stumbling block right now is how "our" insignia will differ from the USAF.
We still have to figure out what we want and then we have to get it approved by the AF.
But the AF has said in the past that they want us in the ABU.

Why not just keep the same blue and white tapes we've always had?  Every time we turn around SOMEBODY wants to reinvent the horse.

Because they look like crap on the BBDU. It's not so bad on the BDUs but they just look faded and mismatched on the BBDU.

[RADIOMAN015]

The USAF requirement for all servicemembers to be in ABU's is Novemberish/ End of Third Fiscal Quarter. After that date, it'll take a minimum of a year to start an official phase-in of ABU's, but that is in a best of case situation.

The USAF requirement is September 30, 2011.  The AF has said in the past that when they have all of their people in the ABU that CAP would then be allowed to wear it.
From what I have heard/seen, the only stumbling block right now is how "our" insignia will differ from the USAF.
We still have to figure out what we want and then we have to get it approved by the AF.
But the AF has said in the past that they want us in the ABU.

Why not just keep the same blue and white tapes we've always had?  Every time we turn around SOMEBODY wants to reinvent the horse.

Grumpy, I wouldn't worry about that too much.  IF the change EVER comes about, there's absolutely no way the USAF is going to allow CAP to wear anything subdued matching the ABU uniform.  CAP's blue background with white lettering is what they consider "distinctive".   Hasn't the blue background and white lettering been around for at least 25 years or more
RM

[ol'fido]

Longer than that but we weren't changing uniforms every few years either. The pickle suits were around for about 30-40 some odd years in one material or another and BDUs have been around for about 20 years now(these timelines are CAP only).

[Buzz]

Hasn't the blue background and white lettering been around for at least 25 years or more ?

At least 40 years, that's what we had when I come in as a cadet.

However, at the time, AF fatigues also had white on blue, so we matched.

I think that white on blue is a good standard with everything but the BBDU.

[AngelWings]

 If we go to ABU's, we should update to ABU style name/service tapes. It would be disrespectful to the members of the USAF to be wearing the ABU's with such a ugly set of tapes.

[Zen Master Charlie]

If we go to ABU's, we should update to ABU style name/service tapes. It would be disrespectful to the members of the USAF to be wearing the ABU's with such a ugly set of tapes.

Try getting that one past the Air Force 

There is a lot of history behind our uniform, involving the Air Force, and most of it inst very glamerous... There is a reason behind everything we wear, and the Air Force has the final say in what we use (if its their's)

[AngelWings]

If we go to ABU's, we should update to ABU style name/service tapes. It would be disrespectful to the members of the USAF to be wearing the ABU's with such a ugly set of tapes.

Try getting that one past the Air Force 

There is a lot of history behind our uniform, involving the Air Force, and most of it inst very glamerous... There is a reason behind everything we wear, and the Air Force has the final say in what we use (if its their's)

I get what you are saying, and I don't argue the point. What I'm going to say is just in frustration with the history.
What's so special about blue tapes? Did someone not get the memo that we switched to the BDU's? If they want to make us look like a bunch of wannabes, then critize us about that, then something is terribly wrong. I don't see much of a history between the blue tapes and CAP. I see no need for it, because the service tape is supposed to identify what organziation your in, so it is counterproductive to keep the blue tapes. We don't even use "U.S" in our service tapes, so I don't even get it. And to kill any idea that the blue tapes make us distinctive, on 4th of july, I was in a parade, and our blue tapes were has visible has can be, and we still had people calling us soldiers. It doesn't serve a distinctive purpose because the uniform itself is military, and that is what people see and connect with the military. If we want to be distinctive, how about we wear pink boots  ? 

[titanII]

the service tape is supposed to identify what organziation your in, so it is counterproductive to keep the blue tapes.

I think the word you were looking for is redundant, as both the service tape and the ultramarine blue identify us as Civil Air Patrol

And as for the rest of your post, civvies may not be able to distinguish us from the military, but I think that those in the military can. That has to count for something. The point of being distinctive is to be distinctive from other uniformed services, but not so distinctive that we are no longer a uniformed service.

[Hawk200]

I'd be happy with navy blue tapes, rank, and accoutrements. Tapes and rank are available now, all we'd need are the other insignia.

[AngelWings]

the service tape is supposed to identify what organziation your in, so it is counterproductive to keep the blue tapes.

I think the word you were looking for is redundant, as both the service tape and the ultramarine blue identify us as Civil Air Patrol

And as for the rest of your post, civvies may not be able to distinguish us from the military, but I think that those in the military can. That has to count for something. The point of being distinctive is to be distinctive from other uniformed services, but not so distinctive that we are no longer a uniformed service.

The service tape is all we need. Most of the time, you'll see guys in the guard look at your blouse, and read the tape mentally, and say "Oh, your in Civil Air Patrol?". It is overly redundant (counterproductive doesn't fit in nearly has well has redundant). I trust them to read the tapes like a normal person. There is nothing positively distinctive about ultramarine blue. It looks stupid on a camouflage uniform. It didn't even look that great on the greens IMO , let alone the lime green, desert tan, tree brown, and shadow black BDU. It is just going to look worse on the ABU when we get it. It is time to update to the current times, rather than staying in the 70's.

[lordmonar]

If we need instant distiction in ABU's.....I propose a blue base ball cap with squadron patch on it.

It allows us to keep the squadron patchs....and is instantly identifies us at ranges up to 5 miles as CAP.

There is precidence in the USAF for this sort of thing....the Red Horse guys all wear red hats.

That way we go with subdued tapes and ranks....and don't have to come up with anything special for things like the APEX jacket and such.

If we are in a hats off situation.....we will all be at ranges where we can read "Civil Air Patrol" on the name tapes.

[AngelWings]

If we need instant distiction in ABU's.....I propose a blue base ball cap with squadron patch on it.

It allows us to keep the squadron patchs....and is instantly identifies us at ranges up to 5 miles as CAP.

There is precidence in the USAF for this sort of thing....the Red Horse guys all wear red hats.

That way we go with subdued tapes and ranks....and don't have to come up with anything special for things like the APEX jacket and such.

If we are in a hats off situation.....we will all be at ranges where we can read "Civil Air Patrol" on the name tapes.

I'd say we stick away from the speciality hats. It is time to look like we are the USAF Aux, not USAF wannabes. AFJROTC wears subdued insignia and regular Patrol Caps, so why shouldn't we? We are alot more USAF intwined than AFJROTC to begin with.

[lordmonar]

I agree with you in principle.....but we do have to consider the USAF's supposed need to keep us distinctive.

Comparing us with AFJROTC is a little different because their cadets are not wearing Col's Birds.

[Hawk200]

It is time to look like we are the USAF Aux, not USAF wannabes. AFJROTC wears subdued insignia and regular Patrol Caps, so why shouldn't we?

Keep in mind that the color of our tapes isn't up to us. If you want an answer to that, you need to find someone in the Air Force that is responsible for that particular configuration and get the answer from them. No one with CAP knows the true answer at present.

Yes, there are things about being significantly different in low light conditions, but the why is not presently known. (And I'm talking the legitimate "why" not the hearsay.)