ABU's???

[BillB]

AlphaSigOU

Atleast you could wear what you wore in Miami High in Kwajalein. No need to buy new attire.

[AlphaSigOU]

AlphaSigOU

Atleast you could wear what you wore in Miami High in Kwajalein. No need to buy new attire.

Miami High?!?!? Ain't no 'Stingaree' (yes, that's the mascot of Miami High)... I still bleed Green and Gray (graduated from North Miami High)! GO PIONEERS! 

[CCAlex]

As Eclipse said many times that CAP will never wear ABU's, I think that we'll wear them eventually, but only after the air force phases out to wear some other uniform. I think that there would probably always be a difference in the uniforms because CAP is not the air force, hence, they'll want to make the distinction between them. A problem I see for the cadets is that, there would probably be no more inspection because you don't iron ABU's, and the "vomit green" boots will never be shined. I think it may be a while before we switch.

[kmbarnes1]

We'd still need inspections: Grooming standards, eyes front and not wandering, standing up straight, shoes on the right feet (yes, I've seen a cadet wear their boots backwards), patches in the right locations, etc.

Plus you need inspections for Blues

[Майор Хаткевич]

We'd still need inspections: Grooming standards, eyes front and not wandering, standing up straight, shoes on the right feet (yes, I've seen a cadet wear their boots backwards), patches in the right locations, etc.

Plus you need inspections for Blues

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes. Pin on (and Sew on) grade, etc. etc.

I've NEVER done an inspection, either in ranks or performing the inspection, where I heard/gave anyone a comment on their actual clothing, UNLESS it was excessively dirty/un-tucked/wrinkled/etc.

[JC004]

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes.^{[citation needed]} ...

[Hawk200]

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes.^{[citation needed]} ...

I've seen it. In Civil Air Patrol, in the Air Force, and in the Army (although, in fairness, with ACU's this is an easy mistake to make on occasion.)

[Майор Хаткевич]

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes.^{[citation needed]} ...

It's my experience, if we want to get anal about it.

Typically, if cadets screw it up, they don't correct it right away. The same cadet can get cited on it for months, until they either get a talk from a SM, or leave the program. Attention to detail, it's all about the attention to detail.

[Eclipse]

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes.^{[citation needed]} ...

It's my experience, if we want to get anal about it.

Typically, if cadets screw it up, they don't correct it right away. The same cadet can get cited on it for months, until they either get a talk from a SM, or leave the program. Attention to detail, it's all about the attention to detail.

There are also those units who "know better", like setting cadet grade at an angle that "looks cooler".  It is corrected outside the unit, only to be put back wrong the next time you see them.

[JC004]

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes.^{[citation needed]} ...

I've seen it. In Civil Air Patrol, in the Air Force, and in the Army (although, in fairness, with ACU's this is an easy mistake to make on occasion.)

I'd think the most common would be the second sentence, but most importantly, we should add some fun from Wikipedia.  Election time is coming, so everyone should be making signs that say "[citation needed]" to take with them to rallies and other events.

[CadetMurphy]

this is going to be around 2014?

[JC004]

Don't forget the most common mistake: improperly placed name/branch tapes.^{[citation needed]} ...

It's my experience, if we want to get anal about it.

Typically, if cadets screw it up, they don't correct it right away. The same cadet can get cited on it for months, until they either get a talk from a SM, or leave the program. Attention to detail, it's all about the attention to detail.

There are also those units who "know better", like setting cadet grade at an angle that "looks cooler".  It is corrected outside the unit, only to be put back wrong the next time you see them.

I've seen units tell their C/SNCOs to wear them at an angle for "safety" reasons...  Because hundreds of cadets have died this way...

this is going to be around 2014?

Who told you this?

[SarDragon]

Did you miss the question mark?

[SoCalMarine]

As Eclipse said many times that CAP will never wear ABU's, I think that we'll wear them eventually, but only after the air force phases out to wear some other uniform. I think that there would probably always be a difference in the uniforms because CAP is not the air force, hence, they'll want to make the distinction between them. A problem I see for the cadets is that, there would probably be no more inspection because you don't iron ABU's, and the "vomit green" boots will never be shined. I think it may be a while before we switch.

I don't think this is true at all. The USAF switched to BDUs in the early 80's. CAP switched to the BDUs in the early 90's. So, for over 10 years CAP and the USAF wore the same uniform. Prior to BDUs both CAP and the USAF wore fatigues. In fact, the current practice of blue nametapes and full color patches and rank on the BDUs for CAP is a holdover from the fatigues. I would imagine that if the USAF stays with ABUs that CAP will make the switch roughly 5-10 years out from the USAF required wear date.

Anyway, the last I heard from Col Desmarais who works daily with National said that ABUs are not in the foreseeable future for CAP. He told us that at the end of NESA in 2010.

[Angus]

As Eclipse said many times that CAP will never wear ABU's, I think that we'll wear them eventually, but only after the air force phases out to wear some other uniform. I think that there would probably always be a difference in the uniforms because CAP is not the air force, hence, they'll want to make the distinction between them. A problem I see for the cadets is that, there would probably be no more inspection because you don't iron ABU's, and the "vomit green" boots will never be shined. I think it may be a while before we switch.

A couple things here because like all good CAP members I like to get a little anal. 

At the start of your post you qoute the opinion of another board member and agee with that post.  However in your next sentance you go against the "no ABU's" and say you think we will get them eventually.  Please pick a camp and stay in it.

Next you say that we're not the Air Force.  As I'm sure you need no reminding CAP is the Air Force Auxiliary.  And thus we are part of the Air Force family.  The Air Force has stated in the past that they value the relationship between "Ma Blue" and ourselves.  That being said that is why we are authorized to wear the uniform of the Air Force.


Now to add my 2 cents to the whole debate (again).  I do think that at some point we will get the ABU.  If the phase in date is set for this year for the Air Force it will definitely be some time after that.  Next taking into account how we would want to display our current uniform patches to that uniform and the debate internally and then a presentation to the Air Force and they're response and any possible back and forth.  I'm going to say November of 2012 at the absolute earlest is when we'd start to see anything. 

[Майор Хаткевич]

The one thing I don't get, is the debate over the patches. I doubt we'd shift from full color, but perhaps a shift in tape colors would be good. The green uniforms to BDUs, the blue carried over ok. But with the ABU, the colors just contrast too much. Then again, the mockup that Eclipse made back in 2007 didn't look all that bad (from a distance!)

[Angus]

If we do a change in tapes, the only thing I pray is that we get away from the Ultramarine Blue as so many have asked for.  I'm usually in my BBDU (even though I meet the weight & grooming standard)  and the dark blue with that splash of ultramarine looks horrible and not functional at all.  Most importantly while working with other agencies it doesn't carry a sense of professionalism to me.

I've got other issues I'll post later.  Just gotta figure out where they go cause it falls into this and es at the same time. 

[SoCalMarine]

If we do a change in tapes, the only thing I pray is that we get away from the Ultramarine Blue as so many have asked for.  I'm usually in my BBDU (even though I meet the weight & grooming standard)  and the dark blue with that splash of ultramarine looks horrible and not functional at all.  Most importantly while working with other agencies it doesn't carry a sense of professionalism to me.

I'd agree. I would hope that if we switched to ABUs that we at least moved to the BDU tapes since they are subdued. They'd still stand out enough for the USAF to tell we're not AF personnel, but not look like a mickey mouse outfit.

[Phillip]

The one thing I don't get, is the debate over the patches. I doubt we'd shift from full color, but perhaps a shift in tape colors would be good.

If we do a change in tapes, the only thing I pray is that we get away from the Ultramarine Blue as so many have asked for.

I would hope that if we switched to ABUs that we at least moved to the BDU tapes since they are subdued.

When (yeah, I said "when") ABUs are authorized, I really don't see any changes being made to insignia color, though I'd agree Ultramarine needs to go.  I foresee the conversation between USAF and CAP going like this:

USAF: "Ok, y'all can wear the ABUs now."
CAP: "Yay!  But with what insignia?"
USAF: "Um...whatever we authorized you to use on the current BDUs."

USAF isn't going to have time to review various proposals for a CAP version of the ABUs and in light of the whole CSU thing, I don't think NHQ is going to press the issue.

[CCAlex]

Flint,
I do know that CAP is part of the air force family, and I believe that we are only the Air force Aux. when we are on a chartered mission. I did pick a camp and stayed with it, because Eclipse said that we will never get ABU's, and I stated my opinion otherwise. I did not contradict myself saying that we will transfer later, and my opinion is that we will. I stayed with that, and I will still say that.