AAFES Telephone Purchase help

[SAREXinNY]

Every time I make an AAFES purchase I want to bang my head against the wall.  It's never easy, and always requires multiple follow-up calls and/or me re-sending my CAP ID to them for verification.  I can completely understand the frustration some people are going through with the whole process.  Considering the last time I ordered was nearly two years ago, this issue should have been resolved by now.  It's discouraging to hear that very little has changed.

[Robert Hartigan]

The mail order options does not work, in my opinion formed after my experience. I requested a catalog. Request denied because CAP was not recognized as an authorized buyer. There was no notice of the denial. Follow up phone call revealed MCSS did not have a method to verify the copy of my membership card was valid; I got the terrorist speech that anyone could photoshop the card for nefarious reasons. I didn't respond, but I wanted to say terrorist use eBay.

Asked for the catalog anyway. Told no.  Started over thinking maybe someone else  would  open the envelope. Sent copies of regulations, AF and CAP, outlining  the authorization to purchase along with copies of my membership card, driver's license and passport.

Waited, waited, waited. Meanwhile found the telephone ordering info about calling Lackland MCSS. Put order together in late September 2014. A few phone calls and a membership verification email from KC Jones and my order was placed the first week of October and had it before the weekend.

I am 4 1/2 hours away from WPAFB. I am making the trip to MCSS to get uniforms for my new senior members because I don't want them to feel left out. The kicker is this is a 3 minute order by telephone that I should be able to make at lunch that has been turned into a vacation day and an all day drive for a 30 minute in store visit.

[LTC Don]

The mail order options does not work, in my opinion formed after my experience. I requested a catalog. Request denied because CAP was not recognized as an authorized buyer. There was no notice of the denial. Follow up phone call revealed MCSS did not have a method to verify the copy of my membership card was valid; I got the terrorist speech that anyone could photoshop the card for nefarious reasons. I didn't respond, but I wanted to say terrorist use eBay.

Asked for the catalog anyway. Told no.  Started over thinking maybe someone else  would  open the envelope. Sent copies of regulations, AF and CAP, outlining  the authorization to purchase along with copies of my membership card, driver's license and passport.

Waited, waited, waited. Meanwhile found the telephone ordering info about calling Lackland MCSS. Put order together in late September 2014. A few phone calls and a membership verification email from KC Jones and my order was placed the first week of October and had it before the weekend.

I am 4 1/2 hours away from WPAFB. I am making the trip to MCSS to get uniforms for my new senior members because I don't want them to feel left out. The kicker is this is a 3 minute order by telephone that I should be able to make at lunch that has been turned into a vacation day and an all day drive for a 30 minute in store visit.

Major props to you for being willing to help out your squadron colleagues like that. Taking a vacation day(s) for CAP is a very expensive proposition for any member, among the other incurred time, talent, and treasure.

[TheTravelingAirman]

I would like to point out to anyone who cares, every base I've been to so far, the Military Clothing Sales Store (MCSS) was AAFES. It's just another thing they run, like the BX/PX, shoppette, or food court. All fall under their umbrella.

That said, since I am in the MCSS about once a week for Base Honor Guard stuff, I can inquire about catalogs or whatnot for any east coast guys. I'd love to help the other regions, but that's a lot of people. Gotta start small.

[Eclipse]

I would like to point out to anyone who cares, every base I've been to so far, the Military Clothing Sales Store (MCSS) was AAFES. It's just another thing they run, like the BX/PX, shoppette, or food court. All fall under their umbrella.

Not all bases CAP members have access to are Air Force or Army, and not all AAFES Exchanges are created equal.
My wing has two major bases - one USAF and one Navy - and access to them is not ubiquitous or even necessarily possible some days,
and that doesn't take into account that the USAF base, while a Major Command, is 4-6+ hours away from the major population
center of the state, and the other nearest base is 2+ hours in the other direction, and again, access isn't a given.

The Navy base has always been generous with CAP members, and the NAVEx can tailor items brought in, but other then a small rack
of grade insignia, and generic things like boots, blousers, etc., there hasn't been much a CAP member can wear available there since
the Navy started moving over to NWUs some 5-6 years ago.  (Though nothing says "I forgot" like a cadet wearing an 8-pointed cover.)

I've been to at least one AAFES exchange that was the equivalent of a quicky mart with a small uniform area that looked more like an afterthought
then a supply center - if that's the one "within 1-2 hours drive" it's not going to be much use, especially for anything that is harder to get.

I can't even imagine the angst level of someone willing to drive 4+ hours to buy uniform parts only to get there and find out
the base commander has a CoC coming up, or an inspection, etc., and the store looks like a Home Depot the week before a hurricane,
or worse, there's a last-minute force protection or other issue that precludes access anyone but key personnel - BTDT plenty of times.
We can also add the 30 minutes to an hour plus you might spend at the VC on a busy weekend hoping to get a day pass - and "calling ahead"
doesn't necessarily mean anything.

You can filter out many reserve and guard bases as well, especially if they have little or no permanently stationed personnel.
Those that have exchanges get gutted on UTA weekends for the same reason(s) mentioned above, and/or don't carry much to begin with.

36 states may have a USAF MCSS, but that does not equal "36 places CAP members can buy uniforms" - and knowing the
number of members who have reasonable access to these facilities should be something NHQ has at its finger tips, and those relationships
should be the direct responsibility of someone at NHQ in supply or vendor relations.  This smacks of the messages sent out last month
by the AE directorate wanting to know which units are within 50 miles of a military base, again something NHQ should know without
having to access the field.  Considering the small number of bases these days, and the small number of units, and the free tools available
to anyone with a zip code listing.  (Can I opt-out of the foundation spam and have a letter go to the nearest base reminding them that
members should be allowed to buy uniform items?)

Frankly, to suggest that MCSS is a viable option for CAP members, except for the few that already have circumstantial access to
an appropriate military base, ignores the reality of the current state of members getting on those bases at all, not to mention the
shrinkage of the number of bases in relation to CAP member locations.

[Storm Chaser]

So what is the solution?

[Robert Hartigan]

I received a direct answer from the MCS Manager regarding telephone ordering. It is not a state law issue as previously reported. She said it is matter of their policy not to accept credit card phone orders anymore from CAP members because of non payment issues. I am not sure or understand why they would release merchandise without credit card authorization, but someone, sometime, messed up our reputation. This is why we can't have nice things!

[Storm Chaser]

That doesn't seem like a reasonable answer. Nevertheless, this is an issue that must be addressed not by AAFES employees or our members, but by the National Commander with the Air Force leadership.

[Ned]

Not all bases CAP members have access to are Air Force or Army, and not all AAFES Exchanges are created equal.

Of course.  Many members can find at least some uniform items at other places like NEX or even Guard / Reserve facilities.  That's great, but like commercial sources (BDU.com, Army-Navy stores, etc.), pretty much outside the scope of our discussion.

But even the most modest AAFES location will almost always have the basic uniform items (service dress components, footwear, etc) that CAP members are permitted to purchase.  And if for some reason a particular it is not in stock, they will cheerfully order it.  They have certainly done so for me when they were out of a particular size, for example.

36 states may have a USAF MCSS, but that does not equal "36 places CAP members can buy uniforms"

Absolutely true.  Because the actual number of large AF facilities in the US is much larger than 36.  It's over 60.  (Several large wings like Florida, California, and Texas have multiple large AFBs.)

And several bases are located in areas convenient to multiple wings.  Example:  McGuire AFB, in New Jersey, which is a little less than an hour's drive from Philly and a little over an hour from Staten Island, Wilmington Delaware, and Aberdeen, Maryland.

Frankly, to suggest that MCSS is a viable option for CAP members, except for the few that already have circumstantial access to
an appropriate military base, ignores the reality of the current state of members getting on those bases at all, not to mention the
shrinkage of the number of bases in relation to CAP member locations.

While most members probably have an AFMCSS within a couple of hours, I can only agree that we can not rely on MCSS as the "total solution."  Which is why we have multiple vendors and multiple sources, including VG with 24/7 web availability, AAFES via mail order and (cumbersome) telephone access.

Plus internal CAP supplies.  And members can also choose commercial suppliers for some items.

The issue is "can all CAP members obtain necessary uniforms and insignia reasonably conveniently and at a decent price." 

The solution is "have multiple vendors and purchasing methods."  The AAFES telephone access is a small part of the solution, and to the extent that it is having issues, it is being fixed.  But even if it cannot be repaired, CAP members will still have essentially the same access to uniforms that they have had for decades.  The overwhelming majority of members are able to provide themselves with uniforms using our existing vendor constellation.

This particular glass is far more than half-full. 

[LTC Don]

The solution is "have multiple vendors and purchasing methods."  The AAFES telephone access is a small part of the solution, and to the extent that it is having issues, it is being fixed.  But even if it cannot be repaired, CAP members will still have essentially the same access to uniforms that they have had for decades.  The overwhelming majority of members are able to provide themselves with uniforms using our existing vendor constellation.

This particular glass is far more than half-full.

Wow! 

I try to stay out of these CAPTalk slingfests, but that is one huge honkin' pitcher of Kool-Aid right there.

[Shuman 14]

Wow! 

I try to stay out of these CAPTalk slingfests, but that is one huge honkin' pitcher of Kool-Aid right there.

[Al Sayre]

Might be nice if NHQ would set it up so at least those with fairly large orders could do it through NHQ and someone would drive down the street and place/pickup the order for them.  Add on the shipping and 10 bucks for the trouble... 

[Eclipse]

This particular glass is far more than half-full.

Apparently from your vantage point, it is.

The reality of the rank and file members disagrees.  NHQ purports to set up a lot of things,
but the real world keeps getting in the way.

[NIN]

Sadly, the AF base nearest me (Hanscom) is apparently as defensible as Fort Knox to the rank-and-file CAP member.   This is per my unit commander, who has the most recent experience with trying to get to the MCSS there.

I haven't been there in YEARS (like seriously, almost 10 years maybe?) so I don't know how accurate the assessment of the accessibility is, but he is not the only person I've heard this from, either.  Since the base is like an hour or more from me, I haven't even bothered to try in the face of "don't bother trying to get on base. You can't."

We used to take squadron trips there to the MCSS and Airman's Attic/Thrift Store, but the squadron stopped doing that when access became "difficult."

[PHall]

Sadly, the AF base nearest me (Hanscom) is apparently as defensible as Fort Knox to the rank-and-file CAP member.   This is per my unit commander, who has the most recent experience with trying to get to the MCSS there.

I haven't been there in YEARS (like seriously, almost 10 years maybe?) so I don't know how accurate the assessment of the accessibility is, but he is not the only person I've heard this from, either.  Since the base is like an hour or more from me, I haven't even bothered to try in the face of "don't bother trying to get on base. You can't."

We used to take squadron trips there to the MCSS and Airman's Attic/Thrift Store, but the squadron stopped doing that when access became "difficult."

Interesting considering that there are no aircraft assigned to this base.  And all of their "secret squirrel" research goes on inside of "very" secure buildings.
Interesting indeed!!!

[Luis R. Ramos]

Mr Hall, If you do not like it, do not answer. I have to sit through many, many topics that are as silly or more, and do not say anything.

Why do you have to criticize everything, as if you have a chip on your shoulder?

[PHall]

Mr Hall, If you do not like it, do not answer. I have to sit through many, many topics that are as silly or more, and do not say anything.

Why do you have to criticize everything, as if you have a chip on your shoulder?

Oh so it's okay for others, like you for example, to criticize things and I'm not allowed to?

Yeah, that ain't happening.

[Luis R. Ramos]

Mr Hall, did you read who was the one that first stated something about being a hater? Apparently not. You should have pointed your rant towards Nuke, not me. Nuke said Eclipse was a hater.

Or are you one of those that label everyone that says something negative about something a hater?

[Nuke52]

Mr Hall, If you do not like it, do not answer. I have to sit through many, many topics that are as silly or more, and do not say anything.

Mr Ramos, unfortunately you just passed on a perfect opportunity to do just that.  Too bad. For us, that is...

[Nuke52]

Mr Hall, did you read who was the one that first stated something about being a hater? Apparently not. You should have pointed your rant towards Nuke, not me. Nuke said Eclipse was a hater.

Or are you one of those that label everyone that says something negative about something a hater?

Actually, I didn't.  I said, and I quote, "Eclipse, why ya gotta hate?"  Not the same thing, but it does illustrate that perhaps a basic reading/reading comprehension test should be a pre-requisite for posting on CAP Talk... 

More importantly, however, it shows that you need to turn down the squelch on your sarcasm detector.  Or maybe dial down the sensitivity of that chip on your shoulder...  Though I fully appreciate voice intonation is difficult to pick up from the written word, read in context with the quoted passages, the reference to Kool-aid, and the periods of ellipse following the jab at NHQ's ability to make anything "fine" simply by being aware, it should have been fairly clear that I was on Eclipse's side of that argument.  Maybe the true lesson here is really for me:  I should overdo the use of emoticons to allow for the comprehension of the LCD.  Or I could just continue on as now, not caring...    (see what I did there?)

Bob, I thought your sensors were better tuned than that. My sincerest apologies!